Kate Thwaites (Jagajaga, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Hansard source

It is important that we have this debate in this space, because the COVIDSafe app has the potential to be a valuable tool in helping to manage the spread of the coronavirus. It gives public health officials another means to do contact tracing, particularly when people start moving around more. Of course, to do that the app has to be effective in how it operates and Australians have to have confidence in it and they have to believe that the government has made the right decisions when it comes to their privacy. We're starting here from a base where many Australians are sceptical about the government when it comes to trust and particularly when it comes to trusting government with technological solutions. They do have hesitation in sharing information with government. So this legislation, the Privacy Amendment (Public Health Contact Information) Bill 2020, is an important step in building some public confidence in the app and hopefully reassuring more people such that they'll download it.

As the centre of this crisis, Labor has sought to work in good faith with the government to do what is needed to keep people safe. So it is important for me to acknowledge that the government has engaged constructively with Labor on this legislation and that since the draft was released that the government has accepted a number of suggestions Labor has made to improve this legislation. That's a positive thing that we have been able to work together to make this legislation and the privacy in this legislation stronger. It is also important that reviewing this app and the privacy concerns will be part of the work that the Senate Select Committee on COVID-19 does because, again, this goes to trust in government and trust in its actions during this crisis. That trust will continue to be an integral part of helping us to navigate this crisis.

It's for that reason that I take this opportunity to call on the government to reconsider its suspension of parliament until August. Trust matters, and oversight and scrutiny are part of what builds trust. All of us here have been elected by our communities to come to this place and to represent them, and in a time of crisis that is more important than ever. So it's important that we have the chance to discuss this legislation today and that we have the chance to discuss legislation in the future. I urge the government to make sure that we come back to be able to do that before August.

Despite the work that this legislation does to support privacy, we know that community members and experts continue to have some privacy concerns. As we heard from the member for Chifley, there are concerns around how the data is being warehoused overseas and what that might mean as well as concerns around the way the government has maybe not taken on board as much outside expertise as it should have when it comes to looking at the source code and possible flaws in it. There do also remain concerns about how the app works and whether it is as effective as it should be. And, as someone representing an electorate with a number of older residents, I am particularly concerned that the app doesn't work on older Android phones. I've had a number of older residents contact my office, feeling very scared because they can't download the app onto their phone.

For those who have managed to download the app but who are perhaps less tech-savvy than some of us, they're really confused about what the app actually does. People have contacted my office very stressed about why they're getting push notifications and whether that's the app trying to tell them that they've actually got COVID-19. Some have been under the misunderstanding that the app will protect them from getting COVID-19 by sending them an alert when they're near someone who's got the virus so they can make a quick exit. This misunderstanding has the potential to affect people's behaviour in public. They may undertake more risky behaviour because they think they're going to get a ping telling them to run. It also has the potential to undermine trust in the app. When people realise this is not how it operates they are going to be less likely to use it. So I really urge the government to consider how they're talking about the app, how they're communicating with the public about the purpose of this—that it's for contact tracing, that it doesn't give them a magical shield that will protect them and that it's not sunscreen but something that will help them find people who they've been around. I think that's really important. Perhaps a public information campaign could also support that.

I know that people in my electorate want to get out and about. They need to get back to work. Too many of them are still falling through the cracks; they're struggling. They need this app to work, so they need to have trust. I commend the government for bringing this legislation. I ask them to do all they can to make sure the app is as effective as possible.

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