Louise Miller-Frost (Boothby, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I move:

That this House:

(1) notes that:

(a) in 2022, Australians lost an estimated $3.1 billion to scams; and

(b) in the last 12 months to April 2023, almost half of all Australians have been scammed, deceived, or exposed to a fake text message;

(2) commends the Government's commitment to crack down on fake text message scams by:

(a) establishing a SMS sender ID registry in the 2023-24 budget; and

(b) committing to tackling illegal scams and keeping Australians safe; and

(3) further notes that the Government's commitment compliments:

(a) the rules registered by the Australian Communications and Media Authority that saw telecommunications companies block more than 90 million scam texts between July and December 2022; and

(b) the Government's investment to establish a National Anti Scam Centre within the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission as an innovative, world-leading public-private sector partnership to disrupt and stop scammers in Australia.

Hi, Mum, it's me. I dropped my phone in the toilet and I'm texting you from a temporary number. Can you WhatsApp me?

Your toll fee is overdue. Click on this link to avoid overdue fines.

Your device has been suspended from e-payments. Click on this link to reactivate your credit card.

Your bank has stopped an unusual transaction. Click on this link to secure your account.

Hi. We're looking for part-time employees. No experience required. Work just one or two hours a day and earn at least $1,000 to $2,000 for five consecutive days.

Unfortunately, these sorts of text messages—and the phone calls and the emails—have become more and more familiar to Australians over the last few years. While we may roll our eyes and laugh at some of these seemingly amateurish attempts, it is sobering to know that Australians lost some $3.1 billion in 2022 to scammers, and that number has been doubling year on year. Telecommunication companies blocked 90 million scam texts between July and December 2022.

Some years ago I heard about an overseas scamming operation that had been shut down by international law enforcement. The key operatives arrested included, as you would expect, people with expertise in computing, but there were also several with PhDs in psychology, because, while we can do a lot technically to protect ourselves, as can the organisations we engage with, through secure passwords, two-factor authentication and the like, social engineering is the way that most people lose to scammers.

Scammers work hard to con people, to trick them into believing that they're your friend, your child, your bank, your internet company, or a great investment or an employment opportunity that will change your life—get in quick! Too many Australians lose big money to scammers. They lose money, they lose their identities, and there is embarrassment, shame and a lack of confidence in engaging with the world around us. While we can measure the amount of money stolen by the scammers every year—at least if the amount is reported to authorities—the damage these scammers do is immeasurable.

Last week Assistant Treasurer Stephen Jones and I held a scams forum in Boothby. The event was booked out within a day or so and we have a waiting list for a repeat event. Mr Jones covered some of the more common types of scams: fishing scams, dating and romance scams, false billing scams, investment scams, employment scams. They are all too-good-to-be-true scams. He also shared a few hints on how to be more aware: protect yourself; take your time; don't let them rush you; be alert to typos. Know that your bank won't engage you as 'Dear Sir/Madam'. Don't click on any links sent to you. Don't give personal information over the phone to callers. If they say they are from a company that you genuinely deal with, stop, hang up and call them back. Look up the organisation's phone number or website independently and call them on a number that you have verified. Don't let anyone have remote access to your computer. Be wary of anyone trying to move you from a public form of social media to a private one such as a WhatsApp or a messenger.

The Albanese government is taking the issue of scams seriously. We have seen the damage scammers are doing in our communities and to individuals, and we are determined to take them on. Part of that is raising awareness and improving education in our communities, and the scams forum being conducted around the country by the Assistant Treasurer is a visible part of that effort. Unlike the previous government, we're not just standing by to watch the scams increase, doubling every year, without lifting a finger.

People all over Australia are saying enough is enough, and that's why we've already taken action, providing $86.5 million to combat scams in this budget. This money will provide $58 million to the ACCC to establish a national antiscam centre to improve detection, deterrence and prevention. There's money for ASIC to combat investment scams and $10.9 million for an SMS sender registry so that, rather than playing catch-up on the phone numbers that we're trying to block for sending scam messages, banks, telecommunication companies, utilities and government agencies will be able to register the genuine numbers that they will contact people from so Australians can feel confident in dealing with those institutions and know to be sceptical about calls from other numbers.

The scams that attack Australians on a daily basis have been increasing over recent years, and the Albanese Labor government is stepping in to protect us all.

Andrew Wilkie (Clark, Independent) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Is the motion seconded?

Luke Gosling (Solomon, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I second the motion and reserve my right to speak.

Andrew Wilkie (Clark, Independent) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I call the member for Monash.

Russell Broadbent (Monash, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

( Thank you, Deputy Speaker, for the invitation to speak on this very important motion. It's not often I get to congratulate the government on things that they're doing, but this is one time that I congratulate them on what they're doing, because they have followed on from the good record of the previous government, which was, sadly, alluded to in a negative form. Two of the smartest people I know—I mean smart people, good businesspeople—were scammed. One cannot retrieve the money, and it's big money. The other, because of a mistake the bank made, was able to retrieve the money, which is a godsend. What I'm putting to you is this: no-one is immune from these scams. We are a nation that thinks people are doing the right thing by us when they get on the phone to us and they offer us help. We think, oh, we're probably out of order there.

I got a scam on tolls. I said to my wife: 'Bron, hang on. I've got a toll problem here. I can't afford to have a toll problem.' She said: 'It's a scam. You don't pay for the tolls; I do. They are having a go at you, but I pay for them. So it's got nothing to do with us; it's a scam.' It didn't look like a scam to me, because I had recently changed my credit card. Automatically I thought, 'Oh, I've changed my credit card; therefore, they want the new details for my credit card,' and I was about to give it to them because it was common sense. What I'm saying is that everybody is vulnerable to this.

I congratulate the government. We lost $3.1 billion to scammers because they're trading on the good people that Australians are.

(b) in the last 12 months to April 2023, almost half of all Australians have been scammed, deceived, or exposed to a fake text message;

It's inconceivable that it could be that amount of people.

… the Government's commitment to crack down on fake text message scams by:

(a) establishing a SMS sender ID registry in the 2023-24 budget; and

(b) committing to tackling illegal scams and keeping Australians safe; and

(3) further notes that the Government's commitment compliments:

(a) the rules registered by the Australian Communications and Media Authority that saw telecommunications companies block more than 90 million scam texts between July and December 2022; and

(b) the Government's investment to establish a National Anti Scam Centre within the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission as an innovative, world-leading public-private sector partnership to disrupt and stop scammers in Australia.

It is unbelievable. This is a monumental attack on every Australian family and on every Australian person, and I commend the government on the process they've put in place to try to tackle this issue.

I know, Deputy Speaker Wilkie, that you'd love the same effort put into problem gambling. I know there are other issues that I would disagree with the government on. I won't go into the processes the former government went into—I'll get a chance later on this evening to do that. I'm appealing to the people that are watching this very good motion. The government can do so much, but there will not be a fire truck at the bottom of your driveway when it comes to scams. The government cannot have a fire truck at the bottom of every cliff. The bank can't save you—it's up to you to be diligent. I have this saying with my staff—and I've lived this through the whole of my 72 years—if in doubt, don't. If there's the slightest doubt, don't go there. Talk to your kids, talk to somebody else before you act on it. Do not give your details to anybody because the bank doesn't ring you and ask you for details—they've got them. Please, I'm begging you—and I've never begged anybody in this parliament before—please have regard for your own wellbeing.

Joanne Ryan (Lalor, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Like the speakers before me, my community has been inundated by scam texts and messages. In fact, in a few recent school visits—it's that time of year in Victoria when the curriculum asks the teachers to talk about our democracy and the levels of government, so I'm often invited in to talk to students about those things—I take the opportunity while there to do a bit of a straw poll on what social things that children as young as grade 4 are aware of. The winner this year is scams.

Every kid that I've asked this question of, and for every class or group of 100 students that I've asked, 'Who's worried about scams?', the hands go up. These young people all have a story about someone in their family being hacked, being scammed, or about money being lost. When we see figures like $3 billion in the last 12 months, it's not a surprise if it's everyone and every family in my electorate that has been receiving these texts. As the member for Boothby said, if people in their busy lives see a text created with some urgency, they act. If a child's in trouble, you act—here's a solution. These scanners are clever. Not only have I got your number, not only do I know you've got a son, but I also know his name because I've hacked your phone and I'm going to set a text up where I not only create the urgent need but also create the solution in one simple text—click, send. They're targeting not only parents with stories about children but also mates. Your best friend sends you a supposed text message asking for financial assistance. There it is, on a busy day, saying they've lost $1000. I'll help fix that! I can fix that! I can be helpful! It's not a surprise when the member for Boothby sites that psychologists are involved in this. This is really clever. Clever, manipulative, criminal—that's what it is.

I'm pleased that our government is taking the action it can at this point in seeking more information for further changes—the first being the SMS Sender ID Registry to protect yourself. I read that and I had to go in and figure out what they're talking about.

What we are actually saying is that the scammers have become so good that they are copying the headers on the text messages that official trusted Australian institutions might use. They are copying those headers, so people who are accustomed to getting a text message from a particular institution, be it your bank, be it someone else, think it is them. Step one—clever—creating urgency. I can't tell you how many Linkt texts I've had in the last six months. Occasionally, they are persistent but they come spasmodically. Occasionally, I go, 'Is this a real one? Should I check?' Of course, as the previous member said, 'It's not real. I don't owe any money to the tolls,' but you would be surprised how many Australians believe they do, because people often have busy lives, take a toll road and think they will pay for it later. They then can't remember what day they did it or whether or not they paid for it.

Not just Linkt messages have I had. I've also had so many packages at the Alice Springs Post Office waiting for collection. I've lost count of the number of times I've had a package waiting. And do you know how I figured out it was Alice Springs? I googled it to find out where that post office was and went, 'I couldn't possibly have a package waiting for me in Alice Springs.' But I would have had 400 of those texts in the last 12 months, so they are persistent, they are consistent and it's not a surprise that Australians, with this psychological effort being made, are being drawn into them. I am pleased this government has made a commitment in the budget and that it has been the actions of this government to look at what can we do and to look at the types of scams. There are ways we can protect, like the ID registry, and then there is the educative part of this around educating Australians to being, quite bluntly, more cynical.

In an age where we are losing trust in our democratic institutions, maybe it's an age where we could get a bit smarter about the things we carry in our hands and the messages we are receiving from people. But the educative process will take a long time. I hope this hits the ground running, that we protect Australians and that we don't lose $3 billion in the next year.

David Coleman (Banks, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Communications) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I'm pleased to speak on this motion on scams. What we are seeing with the scams, unfortunately, is an escalation, where they get more and more sophisticated over time. The technology, frankly, gets better and better, which enables them to pursue more scams and exploit them more effectively. Importantly, scams are migrating increasingly from the text based mobile phone world to the broader digital and social media world. I want to come back to that in a minute because, unfortunately, the government has not acted in that important area.

Back in December 2020, our government introduced an important industry code, a reducing scam calls code, and, under the code, telcos that breached those rules would be fined up to $250,000 on each occasion. There was very, very clear evidence that it worked because in the first 12 months of that new code, 357 million scam calls were blocked and that's a very good thing. In November 2021, we introduced a regulatory amendment to empower the telco sector to block SMS scams at source and, happily, the new government took that up and it was implemented on 1 July last year.

As the ACCC has correctly noted, the true cost of scams is more than a dollar figure because they cause emotional distress to victims, their families and their businesses. We pretty much all have either been the victim of a scam or know someone who has. Unfortunately, it is often older people, who perhaps are not as familiar with technology and who take at face value some of those texts messages and calls that sometimes come along. We've all experienced it and it is a horrible thing, so measures to reduce the incidence of scams are welcome. We certainly have no quibble with the government taking strong steps in this area. We absolutely support that. But there is an important gap in what the government is not doing at the moment as it pertains to scams and this relates to something the ACCC has been calling for in its digital platforms inquiry. The first publication was November last year and there was a six-monthly update a few weeks ago.

The ACCC is particularly focused on broadening the scope of the regulation of scams, not just in the telco world but in the broader digital world as well. So what the ACCC has asked the government to do is to introduce mandatory processes to prevent and remove scams, harmful apps and fake reviews; to establish mandatory internal dispute resolution standards that ensure accessibility, timeliness, accountability, the ability to escalate to a human representative and transparency; and to ensure consumers and small businesses have access to an independent external digital ombudsman scheme.

The Telecommunications Industry Ombudsman, who already exists and regulates the telco sector, put their hand up and said: 'We can do this. We can be the digital ombudsman for scams in a digital world.' On the face of it that would seem very sensible, with the already active telecommunications ombudsman doing precisely this in the telco world. But what about the digital world? What about the scams on Facebook? What about the scams on TikTok, Instagram or any of those platforms? They are currently not captured by these rules, so the government needs to do that.

It's now been six or seven months since the ACCC made this recommendation. Time is of the essence because every day we see literally millions of dollars lost to scams. There really is no time for being slow here. To be frank, the government is hastening a little slowly. Opposition leader Peter Dutton announced in our budget reply speech that this issue is very important. It's a big focus for the coalition, and we will put in place more onerous obligations on big digital companies to stop scams and financial fraud.

A big part of that goes what I've just been talking about: establishing that regulatory environment for the digital world, which doesn't properly exist today. One part is covered and one part, which is enormous, is not covered. It doesn't make sense. The ACCC doesn't think it makes sense. The Telecommunications Industry Ombudsman doesn't think it makes sense. We don't think it makes sense. The government needs to act on that. The SMS sender ID register, blocking people impersonating the government, is a welcome initiative from the government, but it's somewhat ironic given that the most famous scam impersonating a government over text in Australian history was the 'Mediscare' scam purported by the Labor Party.

Andrew Wilkie (Clark, Independent) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The time allotted for this debate has expired. The debate is adjourned and the resumption of the debate will be made an order of the day for the next sitting.