Kerry O'Brien (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Minister for Transport) Share this | Hansard source

I move:

That the Senate take note of answers given by ministers to questions without notice asked by Opposition senators today.

I want to start my contribution by referring to Senator Abetz’s answer to the question I asked him as the Minister representing the Minister for Transport and Regional Services, Mr Vaile. It is interesting that Senator Abetz read the brief he had been given. One would have thought that the furthest thing from the mind of CASA, under the instruction of the minister, would have been anything which might have affirmed that we would move to what to most pilots seems an appallingly ridiculous position where copilots could be trained so that they would be required to have only 10 hours actual flight experience with the balance of their flight experience being obtained in a simulator. Of course, having obtained their standards, pilots update their experience with the new technology of certain aircraft flying in simulators, but frankly the best experience for pilots, according to information that I have been given by pilots, is that they actually fly aircraft—that they learn how aircraft react to turbulence and other circumstances.

The most appalling thing about this regulation is that new copilots will sit next to pilots on aircraft such as the 737, the 747, the A350 and the A380 when it comes on line. That is what this regulation is talking about. As at midday today, CASA says that ‘new licences will provide better training for copilots flying large passenger jets’—that is, instead of having 100 hours flying time in real aircraft, in the air, that they would be better off spending their time in a simulator pretending to fly. I find that amazing; certainly Australian pilots find it amazing. Why do we need to adopt the standard which some countries adopt because they cannot get enough pilots—which is probably why ICAO is considering it—when we have some of the best aviation standards in the world? And why do we go in that direction—that is, reducing the amount of flying time we require our commercial pilots to have before they can be copilots of major aircraft—when at the same time we have our own drivers on Australian roads being required, before they obtain a licence, to have up to 120 hours experience. That is certainly the recommendation that TAC have in relation to any young person newly obtaining a drivers licence.

We had a bit of spin in the minister’s answer, the spin to cover the activities of CASA while it goes through a process of promulgating a regulation which will reduce the requirements for training time. I can see a quizzical look in the eyes of a number of senators opposite who travel regularly, as I do. They are wondering: ‘This cannot be so. We cannot be going through a process which will reduce by 90 per cent the actual flight experience for some of the people who could be flying us and the rest of the public around this great nation.’ That is what the ICAO recommendation provides for from 23 November.

It was pleasing to hear for the first time—and this has not been stated before by CASA—that there is now a commitment to a full safety case being conducted on this matter. If CASA is fair dinkum, a full safety case will compel people to throw this matter into the dustbin. I am not confident that, having conducted a full safety case, CASA will not find a way to promulgate the regulation nevertheless. That is why I say that it has to be an absolute commitment from this government that there will be a full public and open inquiry into this matter before it is promulgated. The only way that is going to happen is if it is properly conducted by an independent committee of this parliament, preferably a Senate committee which is not dominated by someone acting on the instructions of the minister. I think it is appropriate that we proceed very cautiously in this regard and I think the minister needs to give a commitment that safety standards will not be reduced, that they will be maintained. (Time expired)