Christine Milne (Tasmania, Australian Greens) Share this | Hansard source

I want to make a couple of comments about the proposed amendments. I want to indicate that I have had quite extensive consultation with the pilots in relation to the matter that Senator Xenophon was just speaking on—that is, the issue of the taping of the conversations in the cockpit and its length of time. I take the pilots’ point on board that on a long light they might consider this a particularly onerous burden. But having now had a further briefing and upon thinking further about the matter, as I understand it the tape can only be for two hours—and I would like the government to just reassure the committee in relation to this.

My understanding is that the tape can only be for two hours. Because the purpose of the tape is to check the safety systems and so on you could assume that on any kind of flight the tape will include take-off and landing, where all the procedures are gone through. The pilots are given notice beforehand that this is the flight that is going to be recorded and it is only once a year that this occurs. So once a year they are given notice that the tape is going to be made, it is only for a two-hour period and, because it is for the checking of safety procedures and so on, it will be on take-off and landing. I just want the government to clarify that that is the case.

I am also assured that if there is an incident of any kind on the particular flight about which notice has been given for the taping of the procedures then the tape cannot be used in relation to that incident—a separate process or procedure takes effect in looking at and examining that particular incident and other mechanisms are used. So it comes back to this issue of the public interest and the pilots’ interest. In the community’s interest what is being asked here is that, with notice, two hours can be taped for safety procedures when things have gone in a straightforward manner and there has not been an incident.

If you then say, ‘Well, the problem for the pilots is that they will not behave as they normally would in terms of their interaction because they know that they are being taped for two hours,’ the downside of that from the community’s point of view is that pilots can then say, ‘Well, we’re not going to sign off on this.’ I understand that there have been modifications to the position of ‘we’re not going to sign off on this’ which gives the pilots that power, if you like, over what can and what cannot be released.

So on balance I am on the pilots’ side in terms of not wanting to put an onerous burden on them and making them feel as if everything they say is being monitored and watched to be used against them. But there are very strict rules around who can listen to it and what it can actually be used for. So it cannot just be released to the front pages of a daily newspaper speculating on any conversation that might have gone on. There are very strict rules about that with quite severe penalties.

Having listened to both sides of the argument and having engaged with the government about this as well, the Greens do not feel like we can support the amendment. But I do want to be assured by the government that the tape is for two hours maximum and that the likelihood is that, of that two hours, take-off and landing will be part of it. Therefore with notice you know you are going to have to do that, and in those two hours you are not likely to be engaging in much other conversation anyway because of the procedures you have to go through to check off all your systems. I just ask the government to reassure the committee in relation to that before we get to vote on that amendment.