Stephen Parry (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I seek leave to move a motion to provide for the Education Services for Overseas Students Amendment (Re-registration of Providers and Other Measures) Bill 2009 to be recommitted immediately to enable the reconsideration of amendments and consideration of further amendments.

Leave granted.

I move:

That the bill be recommitted to the Committee of the Whole.

I thank the minister for allowing this to take place. Earlier today this bill proceeded to its third reading stage. Because of a misunderstanding in the minister’s office—which we understand; there are busy times in ministers’ offices—regarding the nonmovement of an amendment by Senator Xenophon and an indication that we would not divide on a particular amendment moved by the coalition, we feel it necessary to recommit the bill. I understand the government are going to cooperate and be understanding with the recommittal. Once we move back into the committee stage, Senator Cormann will be asking the chamber to consider schedule 1, item 11, as per sheet 5969 revised. Senator Xenophon will be moving amendments that he did not have an opportunity to move in the earlier session. They will be amendments (1) and (2) on sheet 6041 revised. I believe he will be seeking leave to move those together.

The rearrangement of the order of business today was done quite rapidly at times and that did not facilitate the smooth passage of the legislation. We understand the government needs to do that from time to time. That would be a fairly significant reason as to why the government is cooperating with the recommittal of this bill. Because of the misunderstanding and because of the confusion that has arisen, mainly emanating from the minister’s office, we feel this is the best course of action so that the full function of the Senate is preserved and the will of the Senate in relation to all amendments is properly considered and properly voted on.

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Innovation, Industry, Science and Research) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I would like to speak to that proposition, Mr Deputy President. There is no confusion in the minister’s office, none whatsoever.

Stephen Parry (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Don’t go there.

Alan Ferguson (SA, Deputy-President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order!

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Innovation, Industry, Science and Research) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I will be very clear about this, Senator Parry. The government are agreeing to the recommittal of this matter because we have a longstanding principle here that there is no point carrying a proposition which does not reflect the will of the Senate. But let us be clear about the circumstances. This morning Senator Xenophon and the Greens were not present in the chamber when the matter came before the chamber. Senator Cormann was asked whether he wished to move the amendment in their stead. He chose not to. I understand that senators are busy; I understand that they may well have other commitments. But there was no confusion, on behalf of the government, about this matter. There was none whatsoever. We do not support this amendment. We still do not support this amendment. If this amendment is carried, which I believe it will be according to the numbers people have indicated, this bill as a consequence will have to return to the House of Representatives and the international student colleges and the international providers will not have the protection of this bill.

Stephen Parry (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

That is your issue.

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Innovation, Industry, Science and Research) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

It might be your attitude that it is our issue. It is your irresponsibility that is going to force this industry to be without protection. That will be the point that we will make very loudly and very clearly. There will be no confusion on our part about your responsibility in this fiasco.

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Employment Participation, Apprenticeships and Training) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I am surprised that I am now in a position where I have to participate in this debate at this point in time. The opposition was going to facilitate, as we were keen to facilitate this morning, the easy passage of this legislation in the public interest. Senator Parry was very generous with the minister. Talking about confusion in the minister’s office was a very generous way of describing what happened today. If I can advise the Senate, I received a call from the minister this morning and he advised me that this legislation would come up after non-controversial legislation. But, rather than coming up after noncontroversial legislation, it came up at 12.30 pm, when neither Senator Hanson-Young nor Senator Xenophon were in the chamber. I understand that both Senator Hanson-Young and Senator Xenophon had been advised the same. Now I see them nod so I assume that they were advised by the government along the same lines.

Not only that but in that conversation this morning Senator Carr told me that Senator Xenophon would not be supporting our amendment. On that basis and in the spirit of facilitating passage of this legislation, given that the Greens had given me an indication that they would not be supporting our amendment, I did not call for a division because I did not want to waste the Senate’s time. That was based on the advice from Senator Carr in the conversation this morning. When I arrived in this chamber at 12.30 it was a coincidence. I did not know that this legislation would be coming up at 12.30 pm, because we had been advised that it would be coming up sometime after non-controversial legislation and that it should come up at a quarter past one. I had a private conversation across the chamber with Senator Carr, during which he advised me very explicitly that Senator Xenophon would not be proceeding with his amendment either. As it turns out that was untrue.

That is why I am putting it to the chamber that Senator Parry was being very generous by talking about the misunderstanding. We have had a history of this. This minister is so arrogant, is such a bully and is so aggressive that he cannot help himself. Even today, when we are here to help him facilitate this, he has come in as a bully boy again. Yesterday he was abusing my staff from this chamber. He was talking about people in my office not returning phone calls. That was untrue. I went back to my office and confirmed this, and I was very surprised but I was not going to pick on it again.

The first conversation my office had with anybody from the government on this legislation was on Tuesday night this week, when a lady called Rhonda—and I cannot remember her surname—called my office and ended up talking to an electorate officer. Because the electorate officer was not able to give a detailed explanation on the intent and breadth of the amendments we were about to make, she became quite rude and offensive and off she went. My chief of staff rang her back and there was never any suggestion that we would not be proceeding with the amendments, like the minister suggested. There was never any suggestion that we would be dealing with this matter in non-controversial legislation, because we think the amendments that we are moving and the amendment that Senator Xenophon is moving are important amendments that have to be properly considered. So there have been a lot of dodgy conversations going on, a lot of dodgy misrepresentation going on and a lot of bully tactics going on.

Minister, this is not the way to get cooperation in this chamber. We think it is an important piece of legislation. We are surprised that you are not prepared to entertain amendments that will make this better legislation. We understand that the way this legislation was introduced, all the way back in August last year, was as part of a political strategy for the Deputy Prime Minister. That legislation was introduced two days before she announced her trip to India. We know that was part of the political strategy. You have not progressed this over the last six to seven months. You have wasted weeks and weeks in this chamber with legislation you knew would never have the support of the Senate when you could have been dealing with this, which was much more important.

These are amendments which will be quite important to improve this piece of legislation. Clearly, your attitude to all of this is that you want to pass this legislation so you can be seen to be doing something without doing anything. The reason you will not be supporting these amendments is that you think it is going to cost us some money. You do not want to do anything that is going to cost the government some money. This is going to make a difference and protect overseas students who are stranded across Australia because of colleges that are collapsing on your watch, Minister. You do not want to put anything into this legislation that will actually make a tangible difference and ensure that the education providers out there are proper, professional providers—and not those cowboys that seem to collapse every couple of months—or to ensure sure that students who are caught up with cowboys are properly protected.

Minister, you can carry on with your bullying tactics. We were going to deal with this quite nicely, quite gently and in a speedy fashion; but if this is the way you want to play it, keep on playing and we will keep on playing with you. But I do not know that it is going to do you any favours and I do not think it is in the interests of the Australian people.

Nick Xenophon (SA, Independent) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I do not intend to take more than about two minutes of the Senate’s time and I hope that what I have to say is seen as conciliatory by both sides of the chamber. I think it would be fair to say that, through a series of unfortunate events, the will of the Senate was not properly reflected in the vote in respect of this bill. I am not criticising anyone for that. I can say in relation to my not being in the chamber that I wrongly assumed that this matter was coming up after non-controversial business. I am not criticising anyone for that. I have learnt some lessons from today about trying to manage things better but I think there were some genuine misunderstandings all round and I do not ascribe any malice or bad faith on the part of anyone in this chamber leading to that series of events.

I respect Senator Carr’s position—that he does not agree with these amendments—but I think the process is important, that we deal with this. Also, as Senator Carr acknowledged, I think, quite fairly, this is about reflecting the will of the Senate and that is why the government has not taken issue with this. I hope we can move on with this debate without ascribing any blame, so that we can deal with the substance of the amendments; then, of course, the government is entitled to reject them and we will deal with them in two or three weeks time.

Sarah Hanson-Young (SA, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I do not intend to take up too much of the Senate’s time this afternoon either. I thank the Senate for its cooperation in allowing this discussion and, hopefully, recommitting the bill to the committee stage so that we can have the will of the Senate reflected appropriately. It was very clear, in this chamber last night, where the Greens stood on all the amendments. I made that very clear in my speech in the second reading debate and I made that clear in the last committee stage.

I must say that the Greens have had a good relationship with the Deputy Prime Minister’s office through negotiating on this bill, trying to strengthen it, and that is why I tabled the agreement that I did yesterday. There was always the option of being able to strengthen the bill beyond that, and that is what the amendment put forward by Senator Xenophon and me is doing. I am sad, I must say, to hear that the same type of cooperation and good faith was not necessarily presented to us here in the chamber this afternoon when it was assumed across the chamber, whether it was in a private conversation or not, that perhaps Senator Xenophon and I were withdrawing that amendment. We were very clear last night that we would not be doing that and there was no indication that we would be doing that. In reconciliation, wanting to step forward and give international students the protection they deserve, let us move forward in good faith, recommit to the committee stage and get on with it.

Question agreed to.