Michael Ronaldson (Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Special Minister of State and Scrutiny of Government Waste) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I rise to speak on the government’s response to the community affairs report, Highway to health: better access for rural, regional and remote patients. I want to refer to an article in the Colac Herald from yesterday in relation to health care and the government’s so-called health reform proposals and the proposals from the member for Corangamite. I am unable to describe him in the manner I did earlier, but again this is a remarkable man who seems to have a bit of what I would call ‘Rudditis’—that is, all spin and absolutely no substance at all. This MP is under significant pressure for quite good reasons, because he is a very ineffectual member of parliament. He has not done the work required to be re-elected. Senator Marshall said before that I was upset about us losing the seat. I tell him that he is absolutely right. I was very upset about losing the seat, but I can tell Senator Marshall that I am very pleased that we have a candidate by the name of Sarah Henderson, who will provide a real challenge for Mr Cheeseman.

Gavin Marshall (Victoria, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Will she win it?

Michael Ronaldson (Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Special Minister of State and Scrutiny of Government Waste) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Indeed, she will. The member for Corangamite has lodged a ‘four-point strategy that he says will improve health services in Colac and district’. You just have to read this to believe it; it is remarkable. He said that the strategy would complement a federal government health and hospital reform. He said:

‘My plan for our local region, and the Rudd government’s health and hospital reform program—

wait for this!—

is about having a vision for the way forward, creating health solutions for our region,’ he said.

Mr Cheeseman’s plan includes ‘strongly supporting’ the reforms, which will establish ‘local hospital networks’—

Well, we will see about that!

The plan also includes launching a Colac Otway health petition …

Can you believe it? His four-point health program is about having a vision for the way forward. Well that is going to provide some solutions, isn’t it? Thank goodness he has come out with that four-point plan! Wow, what a way forward! They must be absolutely applauding him down there in Colac. How long has he been there for? Two years. Two years to come up with something for health solutions in Colac, and the best he can do is have a vision for the way forward. All spin and no substance. And to make it worse, Mr Cheeseman knows that what are required in Colac are better health services. What Mr Cheeseman knows is that in Colac what are required are more doctors. And what is his solution? A petition. Why do you need to collect signatures on a petition when you know what the issue is and when you are a government member who can do something about it?

Clearly the Labor Party is rattled because the Leader of the Opposition, Mr Abbott, has a clear view about what should be done, and Mr Abbott knows full well that the best hospitals are the hospitals that have local input into them—always have been, always will be—but the Labor Party cannot bring itself to acknowledge that fact. But we will wait and see what the four-point strategy delivers.

I suspect it is, as Senator Macdonald said a moment ago about another government program, just a whole lot of blah blah. And everyone out there knows what blah blah is—it is just hot air. It is talk that is not going to deliver. And when the best blah blah that you can offer is to have ‘a vision for the way forward’, to quote the Colac Herald, to resolve the health issues of Colac. That is absolute blah, blah—all spin and no substance.

The Australian Labor Party is incapable of addressing the health concerns of regional and rural Australians. They do not understand regional and rural Australia. It is alright for one of Darren Cheeseman’s factional mates to stand up here and protect him—that might make him feel better. When he rings Mr Cheeseman tonight and says, ‘I defended you tonight, mate. They were having a crack at you’ it might make Mr Cheeseman feel better. It might make him feel a bit more loved. It might make Senator Marshall feel as if he is finally serving a useful purpose, but that is about as far as it goes, quite frankly.

They have a so-called vision for the way forward. To have a petition to get signatures on a document where the petitioners themselves know what the issue is but the member does not is a reflection on him, not the petitioners. Senator Marshall is absolutely right. It is a seat that was held by the coalition for a long time and we are going to make sure that when the people of Corangamite go to vote later this year they are going to have a clear choice. It will be a clear choice between someone who is born and raised in the area—someone whose mother was a representative in the state house in Geelong, someone who grew up with politics, someone who understands what it is to provide local support for local people, someone who grew up in a household where community service and community to the public was the most important aspect that she grew up with from a very young age—and someone who was parachuted out of my home town of Ballarat into Geelong, I presume to get some experience. Well, remarkably, and it gives us no joy to say it, he actually got the experience that no one expected him to get. Has he actually learned in those two years and has he actually understood what it is to represent a regional and rural area? No he has not. There is no clearer evidence of that than comments such as the way forward for health in Colac being about ‘having a vision for the way forward.’ What complete and utter tripe. That is a reflection on Mr Cheeseman’s understanding of regional and rural Victoria.

Senator Marshall is just about to stand up. He will defend his factional mate in Victoria. But what Senator Marshall cannot do is cover up the deficiencies of this member of parliament. He cannot cover up his complete and utter lack of understanding of both the area he purports to represent and the hopes, aspirations and ambitions of those people.

If you want to have a fight over Corangamite, Senator Marshall, and about who it is who understands that area, then please bring it on. I will back someone who was born in the area, lived in the area, was raised in the area and had the tutelage of one of the finest women that I had the pleasure to meet, Ann Henderson. She regrettably died some years ago now and was a fantastic representative of the people of Geelong. She was loved and admired across the board. I will put up someone who has grown up in a household where community service and public service was seen as the number one contribution that you could make. I will put that up any day against someone who has parachuted in from Ballarat, who does not understand the electorate, who does not properly represent the electorate and hopefully will no longer be in the electorate after the next election.

Russell Trood (Queensland, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you, Senator Ronaldson. Senator Marshall, just before I call you, I draw your attention to the fact that we are discussing a document relating to Highway to health: better access for rural, regional and remote patients.

Gavin Marshall (Victoria, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you for that reminder and I will try to be even more relevant than Senator Ronaldson was when speaking to that document. I will certainly not go down the low road that Senator Ronaldson has gone down. I wish the Liberal candidate all the best for the election. It is a robust democracy and good luck to her if she can unseat what is a new, dynamic and fantastic member for Corangamite. That is all I will say. I think I suggested earlier in the discussion that Senator Ronaldson has an unhealthy obsession with Mr Cheeseman. I think it might be an unnatural obsession as well, because he really seems to be so obsessed with Mr Cheeseman and I explained earlier why that might be. But it is a little bit rude—

Michael Ronaldson (Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Special Minister of State and Scrutiny of Government Waste) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr Acting Deputy President, I rise on a point of order. This has been a good, spirited debate but I think that is childish and it should be withdrawn.

Gavin Marshall (Victoria, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

If Senator Ronaldson is offended then of course I will withdraw that—

The Acting Deputy President:

Thank you, Senator Marshall.

Gavin Marshall (Victoria, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

because it was only last week that he was referring to me as a very intelligent man. I am sorry I have fallen out of favour so much and had to endure some of his stinging insults today!

Michael Ronaldson (Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Special Minister of State and Scrutiny of Government Waste) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Can I withdraw that!

Gavin Marshall (Victoria, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

You are right. I withdraw that: they were not stinging at all. But it is a little bit rich for Senator Ronaldson to get up and talk about health in this way, when the present Leader of the Opposition, when in government for five years as health minister, took a billion dollars out of the health system. He dragged out of the health system a billion dollars, as health minister. And here we are, with Senator Ronaldson having the gall to get up here and start telling us that what we are doing, our reform program for health and the input from local members—particularly Mr Cheeseman—should somehow be dismissed. Let me tell you that the constituents in Corangamite will not want to go back to a Liberal Party that supports taking even more money out of the health system.

Look at what we have done since we have been in government, a government that Mr Cheeseman is a proud member of. We have actually increased funding in health by 50 per cent. You know what that means in Victoria, Senator Ronaldson? He should know because as a Victorian senator he should understand that that is a $5 billion increase in the health spend in Victoria alone. I notice Senator McGauran from Victoria is already here. He should be incredibly proud of this government for increasing the health spend by $5 billion. You weren’t shaking your head, Senator McGauran? I am sure you do appreciate the extra $5 billion that the government is spending in Victoria. Of course, a lot of that money will go across the board and a lot of that money has ended up in Corangamite. I know Mr Cheeseman works very hard in this government to make sure that the constituents of Corangamite, after 76 years of neglect and being taken for granted by the Liberal Party, are now getting the input and the services that they have been crying out for for a long, long time.

I know Mr Cheeseman is very proud of what this government is doing in health and what we plan to do in health. Of course, the challenge for the opposition will be supporting us in our bold but necessary reform package in health. So let us see when Senator Ronaldson gets here and we have a debate about this in the chamber whether he will be proud enough to step up to the plate and say, ‘Yes, we accept that Mr Abbott, the now opposition leader, took out $1 billion from the health system when he was health minister, but we’ll support this Rudd Labor government in increasing the spend by 50 per cent, which it has already done, and now the reform agenda it has for the health system.’ We are very proud of that and I know Mr Cheeseman is very proud of that. The constituents of Corangamite are benefiting, like every other Victorian and Australian, from the health spend that this government has put in place.

Cory Bernardi (SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary Assisting the Leader of the Opposition) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I feel compelled to respond to what Senator Marshall has just said. I know that Senator Marshall is animated and excited, but when he says that the former minister for health, Tony Abbott, took $1 billion out the health system it is nonsense. It is absolute poppycock.

Gavin Marshall (Victoria, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

It is not!

Cory Bernardi (SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary Assisting the Leader of the Opposition) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Health expenditure grew under the Commonwealth government in real terms every single year and we also saw an increasing contribution from the states because they could afford to, thanks to the GST—all the things that you opposed. You were ripping the heart out of the health system on that side of the chamber, decrying the innovations and the prosperity that Australia enjoyed under the former government, and now we are hearing a revisiting, a reinvention, a rewriting of history to suit those now on the treasury bench. What we can establish is that Australians have never been in more debt than they are now, thanks to this government and its incompetent management.

What we do know is that this radical reform of the health system is more three-card monte from this government, more ‘which cup is the ball under?’ It is designed to trick and obfuscate and hide the truth from the people of Australia. Not one extra bed will be created. No extra money will be going into it. There will be no change to the health system, except there will be more control exerted by Kevin Rudd. Kevin Rudd has failed to deliver at every possible step, and what he has delivered has been mismanaged and has resulted in an appalling waste of money, improper training in job creation programs and unfortunately, I regret, the ultimate price has been paid by a number of Australians. It is shameful. I know Senator Marshall and his troupe will get up here and it will be flamboyant theatre, ‘show business for ugly people’, as he carries on in order to get his moment in the sun. But I am disappointed when we cannot rely on getting the truth. This chamber should rely on the truth. We should be able to rely on the integrity of other senators not to mislead the Australian people, and I want to stand and correct the record.

Ian Macdonald (Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for Northern and Remote Australia) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I rise to speak in this debate on the very significant report by the Standing Committee on Community Affairs, Highway to health: better access for rural, regional and remote patients. It is the government response to that report that we are looking at today. This report was the very dedicated work of the committee looking into all aspects of access to health services for people in rural, regional and remote areas. I remember the committee came to Townsville and took evidence at James Cook University, hearing about some of the good work being done by the university in particular on providing access to rural and regional patients.

When they gave evidence to the committee I met a number of students whom I had previously come across at a little place called Laura up in Cape York, where there was a Laura festival of Indigenous dance. This group of about 20 or 30 young people doing medical studies at James Cook University were out there interacting with Indigenous people and learning something of their customs, how they operate and how people live in those very remote parts of Australia. They were learning that as part of their tuition at James Cook University to become medical practitioners and allied health professionals. If I sound proud of the work that James Cook University does, that is because I am, not just because I am a North Queenslander and I think that things that happen in the north are tremendous but because the students at James Cook University and the James Cook University courses are particularly directed towards the provision of health services to rural and regional and remote Australia.

As I have often said in this chamber, the northern and remote parts of Australia provide a significant proportion of the nation’s wealth. Depending on which figure you use, up to 45 per cent of Australia’s export earnings come from Northern Australia, most of which is fairly remote. If it does not come from Northern Australia, in many instances it comes from places we would class as remote Australia. And yet those people—less than five per cent of the population live north of the Tropic of Capricorn—have very poor access to health services. This is particularly so under the combined maladministration of the Queensland state Labor government, the Northern Territory Labor government and the then Western Australian state Labor government. It has changed slightly in Western Australia in the last year or so as the new government started to pay more attention to the needs and to equity for those people who live in remote Australia.

The rural doctors who were recently here in Canberra attending a function in the Mural Hall indicated that, according to their studies, people in regional, rural and remote Australia were being underfunded to the extent of $1 billion annually for health services. That figure has been assessed by the rural doctors in a very clinical way and in a very economically sound way as well. But it is fact that people who live in rural, regional and remote Australia are underfunded to the extent of $1 billion when it comes to the provision of health services.

Regrettably, for all Mr Rudd’s blah, blah on health services, nowhere has he even recognised this underspend of money on our fellow Australians who happen to live in these more remote and regional parts of Australia. Indeed, Mr Rudd’s health plan will have an even worse impact on people in rural and regional Australia. There is precious little detail in Mr Rudd’s proposal, so it is a bit dangerous for us to talk about it. It is like everything Mr Rudd does: all spin and no detail; all blah, blah, blah and no action. What we can glean from the media appearance and the photo opportunities that Mr Rudd and his health minister took in announcing this magnificent new program is that it seems to be case funded or procedure funded. People who understand the health system have worked out that smaller hospitals—those in country and remote Australia which do not do a lot of procedures—will be worse off financially. They are worse off now.

I do not want to be boring about this but I want to emphasise to senators who might be listening that there is a $1 billion underspend for people in rural and regional Australia currently. Mr Rudd’s plan will make that even worse. Why? Because no-one from the Labor Party has any interest in rural and regional Australia. No-one has any interest in remote Australia and precious little interest in Northern Australia. Have a look around this chamber. The Labor Party senators are nice guys and lovely people but they all come from city areas. They all have backgrounds in the unions or in Labor Party membership. They have got no idea what happens in the real world, particularly the real world out in remote Australia. They do not understand the things that people go through to get access to health services.

My Labor colleagues in the chamber could slip down the corner from where they live in one of the capital cities and see the best specialist going or demand to see a GP, a dentist or a physiotherapist at any time of the day or night. In many instances people in rural and regional Australia have to drive for five to eight hours just to see a GP. They can wait the one or two weeks until the flying doctor comes in but sometimes illnesses do not allow people to wait for a week or two until the flying doctor—who does a marvellous job, I might say—can get in.

This whole issue of access to health services in rural and regional Australia is a very significant one. The committee made some relevant recommendations. The response from the government that we are debating today is, as you would expect, fairly disappointing. There are a lot of words—a lot of blah, blah, blah—but very little action. A new government in this parliament will pay genuine respect to those who live in rural and remote areas and take up a lot of the issues that this committee reported on and which this government has basically dismissed—as is usual—with all of the platitudes, the motherhood statements, the blah, blah, and little action. Certainly the health plan that Mr Rudd announced with such fanfare a couple of days ago does nothing for access to health services in rural, regional and remote areas.

This is becoming a crisis of major proportions for Australia. Some people in Australia live in worse than Third World conditions because they cannot get access to health services. That is a disgraceful thing for a country as wealthy as Australia. I urge the government, in the remaining time they have in office, to seriously look at the issues and to seriously look at programs that might help provide fair and equitable access to health services rather than the sort of blah, blah we got from Mr Rudd earlier this week.

Claire Moore (Queensland, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I did not intend to be part of this debate, but as I was walking past the chamber I happened to hear the dulcet tones of Senator Macdonald once again claiming that only he has any interest, knowledge or awareness of the issues that impact on people who live outside the urban parts of this country. It is simply not true. That cannot remain on the record without some response. I do not think many people actually claim personal ownership of all knowledge. If they do, they are not effectively representing the needs and aspirations of so many in our community.

The document that is the stimulus for this particular range of comments from Senator Macdonald is the government response to a report by the Senate Standing Committee on Community Affairs. We who are privileged to be on the community affairs committee are very, very fortunate because, no matter where we come from, no matter where we happen to be born, work or live, we have the opportunity to hear from people from across this country who give us the great honour of taking seriously the issues about which we are speaking and come forward to share with us their genuine concerns, issues and aspirations. The true role of a committee is in fact, Mr Acting Deputy President Barnett, as you know, to listen to that knowledge—not to presume that we know or pretend that we have all the knowledge but to listen to the people who come forward.

I happen to come from a rural part of Australia. Many of my relatives still live in the Darling Downs region and in other parts of Queensland. That does not mean that only they know and understand issues that relate to rural Queensland. They know about issues like the need for services. Like all Australians, they expect their government to consider their needs in the development of all plans and in particular the health needs of people like them who live outside urban areas—the subject of this report. They expect their government, in taking forward its plans, to include those needs in its proposals. I am really pleased that our community affairs committee, whose members have a wide range of knowledge and backgrounds, has the ability to do the job that it was told it has responsibility for in the Senate process, which is, as I said, to listen to people, gather the evidence, bring it back and put it forward into policy.

Senator Macdonald was speaking about the young people who live and work in Far North Queensland, which is a remarkably beautiful part of the world, and saying that, since the development of the medical school at James Cook University, many are able to train closer to their homes. But it is not next door. You are once again presuming that you know what people’s geographical needs are. Laura is a long way from James Cook University’s medical school, with its Townsville, Cairns and other campuses. You cannot just drive round there, the way people can do in the city. Just because you come from a particular area does not mean you can presume to know exactly how close they are to facilities.

I applaud the knowledge and work that Senator Macdonald does in Far North Queensland. He, along with a great number of politicians who represent that area, can bring valuable knowledge to the debate; they do meet people and bring forward that information. But to use a parliamentary debate to claim that only you understand the place that you come from is just wrong. If we all did that we would not be able to move forward at all. A wide range of people came and gave evidence to the community affairs committee inquiry about which we are speaking including professionals, people who had chosen to work in regional areas, people who live there now, people who used to live there a long time ago and also people who just wanted to ask for a genuinely fair go in getting access to medical services.

After we put forward our report, the government came back with a response. Once again, one of the key elements of the government response was cooperation between the state and federal governments, because the whole health situation in this country depends on the effectiveness of that relationship. The provision of medical services in Australia will always depend on effective cooperation between federal and state governments. Our government has now put forward a proposal which is changing that balance—it is out there for public consideration and debate—but it will rely on the sharing of knowledge and experience, and a commitment to change. That sharing will depend on governments at all levels having a role to play and bringing that forward.

We have a proposal which was not a direct result of the community affairs committee report; I could not claim that. However, one of the many pieces of evidence that came to this government about the needs of people across this country is this report—and again I want to thank the people who came forward and gave evidence before the committee. We must share the knowledge. We as a government and as a parliament, all parties, must listen to the demands of the people who are out there and who turn to us for support. The presumption that we personally have all the knowledge will guarantee that it will fail. It will divide people and, once again, we will get into a competitive model that means that no-one wins, that there will not be effective sharing of resources.

Senator Macdonald used the opportunity of talking to this document to have a go at the most recent government proposal to come out. I encourage members of this parliament to look at the proposal that the government has brought forward after a great deal of consultation and involvement with a range of organisations, with state governments and also with the National Health and Hospitals Reform Commission, which came forward with its report. All of that indicated that all Australians, no matter where they live, have a right to effective medical services, and that is something to which this government is committed.

I am also aware that people expect their politicians to commit themselves to making sure that this can be achieved, to bring their knowledge to the debate again—not to use the opportunity to again divide us, to once again label people on the basis of where they come from or what work they do or have done. Senator Macdonald and others opposite, I have said many times in this chamber that I did work for a trade union, but I also worked for the Australian Public Service and, at one stage, in the Catholic education area. I found all that extraordinarily valuable in providing me with knowledge and giving me experience that I can bring to this chamber. It does not mean that I am not open to listening to and understanding the views of other people. It does not mean that I will automatically label anyone else in this chamber according to where they came from, what school they went to or what job they did. That is not a successful way to share knowledge and move forward.

The role of our community affairs committee has always been to share and to engage. That will continue to be the way we operate. We want to hear what Australians are prepared to say to us. The report before us gave us immense knowledge about what it was like to live in rural and regional Australia and what the needs were in those communities. We as a committee presented a report, which came before this chamber and then went to the government for consideration. It was a really valuable and in many ways confronting experience for all of us. I think we have all gained from this. I hope that we will continue to do so, and I think that the government’s response gives us a way forward into the future, which is what we can expect from the work we do. I seek leave to continue my remarks later.

Leave granted; debate adjourned.