Michaelia Cash (WA, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for Immigration) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Immigration and Citizenship, Senator Carr. I refer the minister to the report by Amnesty International entitled A blow to humanity: torture by judicial caning in Malaysia, which states:

Across Malaysia, government officials regularly tear into the flesh of prisoners with rattan canes travelling up to 160 kilometres per hour. The cane shreds the victim’s naked skin, turns the fatty tissue into pulp, and leaves permanent scars that extend all the way to muscle fibres. Blood and flesh splash off the victim’s body, often accompanied by urine and faeces. This gruesome spectacle is kept hidden from public view.

Given that the Malaysia-Australia transfer agreement is not legally binding, can the minister provide the Senate with an ironclad guarantee that asylum seekers sent by Australia to Malaysia will not under any circumstances at all be caned?

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Innovation, Industry, Science and Research) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

As the minister has indicated on numerous occasions, that is in fact the nature of the agreement.

Opposition Senators:

Opposition senators interjecting—

John Hogg (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

If those on my left wish to debate it, the time is at three o'clock.

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Innovation, Industry, Science and Research) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

If the opposition were serious about humanitarian outcomes, surely they would also recognise that the agreement with Malaysia offers the chance for the resettlement of 4,000 refugees who are currently in Malaysia. Those 4,000 under the UNHCR require protection and are awaiting resettlement. I think it is a very disturbing undercurrent in the opposition views about Malaysia that in regard to its commitment to this agreement—

Honourable senators interjecting—

John Hogg (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Carr, please resume your seat. Motions to take note of answers and debate take place at three o'clock.

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Innovation, Industry, Science and Research) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

What we do know is that there are 4,000 refugees in Malaysia who would under the terms of this agreement be able to be moved to Australia. So on the simple question of whether people that are sent to Malaysia will be caned, the answer is no. They will be treated with dignity and with respect in accordance with human rights standards. That clearly means there will be no caning. That is what the agreement makes very clear. It is important to note that the transferees will have legal authority to remain in Malaysia and be able to work. On the other hand, the proposal that the Liberal Party are advancing is to suggest—

Honourable senators interjecting—

John Hogg (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

When there is silence we will proceed. I remind senators on both sides that this sort of debate across the chamber does not help the dignity of the chamber one iota—not one iota.

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Innovation, Industry, Science and Research) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The Malaysian Minister for Home Affairs made it very clear in his view. He asked:

Are you telling me Malaysia is so bad that we are worse than the human traffickers?

That is clearly what the opposition are now implying, that Malaysia is such a terrible place that it would be better to put these people in the hands of the people smugglers. You ask yourself what level of hypocrisy senators opposite will sink to, and there is clearly no bottom to the pit in which you will fall.

Michaelia Cash (WA, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for Immigration) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, I have a supplementary question. Can the minister explain why the government is prepared to send men, women and children to a country that regularly subjects unlawful entrants to the punishment of caning, is not a signatory to the UN refugee convention and does not meet the standards envisaged by section 198A of the Migration Act? Does the government consider that exposing people to the risk of brutal torture is a humane asylum seeker policy?

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Innovation, Industry, Science and Research) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I come back to the simple point that the agreement makes it very clear that people will not be caned. That is the nature of the agreement. On the other hand, the other part of the agreement, which actually allows for 4,000 refugees who are in Malaysia to be transferred to Australia, is ignored by the opposition. They now want to take it one step further and suggest to us, with extraordinary gall, that their record on human rights—their record in regard to Dr Mohamed Haneef, their record in regard to Cornelia Rau, their actions during their time in administration and the mistreatment of refugees and mistreatment of other people's human rights, their constant abuse of Australian law by the deportation of Australians citizens—ought be compared to an agreement which is actually about trying to improve the lot of 4,000 people who are declared refugees and have the opportunity to come to Australia. (Time expired)

Michaelia Cash (WA, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for Immigration) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, I ask a further supplementary question. After more than three years of cascading failures on border protection, isn't the government now embarking on a policy that inflicts brutal punishment on men, women and children and more failed policy on the Australian people?

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Innovation, Industry, Science and Research) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The answer is no. The simple proposition that they would have this parliament accept is that their record on human rights is so pristine, so pure, despite their habit of locking up Australian citizens, of deporting Australian citizens, of treating refugees with absolute contempt and as a political football, and of vilifying refugees in this country throughout their time in office. You want to cast aspersions? Given your actions and the way in which you treated Dr Haneef and Cornelia Rau and your actions in regard to the children overboard affair, you cannot sit there and seriously claim that you are morally superior to anybody.