David Johnston (WA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Defence) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My question is to the Minister for Defence Materiel, Senator Carr. I refer the minister to the Coles review into the sustainment of the Collins class submarine fleet, which was scathing on the lack of clarity, accountability, authority and responsibility dominating the independent review. Can the minister explain how the government intends fixing this largely non-operational submarine fleet, something ministers Clare and Smith could not do?

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Defence Materiel) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Perhaps in the process I will get some advice from you as to what your policy is for the purchase of these vessels, Senator. As I understand it, the coalition actually has not reached a position on whether or not we need a submarine.

David Johnston (WA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Defence) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

On a point of order, Mr President, I am as flexible as anybody else with respect to flippant answers, but this is not even a vague attempt to answer the question.

John Hogg (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator, there is no point of order. It is 16 seconds into the answer. Senator Carr, you have one minute and 44 seconds remaining to address the question.

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Defence Materiel) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The government is very focused on making sure that there have been lessons learned from the Collins program both in terms of acquisition and sustainment. We are in the business of acquiring future submarines as part of an ongoing capability development to ensure the protection of this country, and I think I am entitled to seek advice from the Liberal Party as to what their position is in these terms.

Four of the six Collins submarines are based in Western Australia. Two are in deep-level maintenance in Adelaide and the government has been assured by Navy that it is able to meet the requirements for the submarine availability to respond to operational needs. The submarine workforce can sustainably crew three submarines in Western Australia and the terms of the submarine availability, its roles and tasks are not discussed of course for obvious security reasons. But in terms of the approach that is being taken to the Collins fleet, we have a highly capable instrument for the defence of this country.

Collins class is fitted with the same advanced combat systems and torpedoes employed in the United States Navy. We are of course working closely with the United States in terms of the maintenance of that capability and, to maintain fleet proficiency, Australia and the United States submarine forces also work routinely together. So as far as the government is concerned, we are dealing with the issues that have arisen with Collins, we remain confident of the capabilities of the Collins submarine program and we look forward to the future development of the submarine program.

David Johnston (WA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Defence) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, I have a supplementary question. I thank the minister for that answer. Given that one of the key recommendations was that resources should be directed to the provision of spares and rotables leading to increased availability, can the minister explain whether or not this has been done and, if not, why not?

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Defence Materiel) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I am not advised that there has been any question about the availability of spares to meet the requirements for the program. This is a program which the government, as is indicated, appreciates the value of. We are learning the lessons of it for our future procurement. All the various options are being looked at in that regard, but in the provision of spares I have not been advised of any difficulty in that particular matter.

David Johnston (WA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Defence) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Given that it costs the Australian taxpayer $800 million per year to operate, sustain and upgrade our submarine fleet—more than the level of waste and mismanagement with the pink batt fiasco—please, what is the government's plan to fix this appalling level of waste and mismanagement?

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Defence Materiel) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I think there are a number of assumptions built into the question which I am not going to concede from this point. What the government has said is that we are learning the lessons of the Collins program.

Australia has particular capability needs which are being addressed through the Collins program. We are looking to the future in terms of the purchase of additional submarine capabilities, and we will draw upon the lessons we have learned in that regard. The advice I have is that the Navy is able to meet the requirements that are set for them in submarine availability and is responding to operational needs in an appropriate way.