Lee Rhiannon (NSW, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Considering when Minister Pyne first—

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Sorry, Senator Rhiannon. You need to assist me by informing me who the question is directed to.

Lee Rhiannon (NSW, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I direct my question to the Minister representing the Minister for Education, Minister Pyne.

Eric Abetz (Tasmania, Liberal Party, Minister for Employment) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Payne.

Honourable senators interjecting—

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order on both sides! Senator Rhiannon, I am just going to clarify. The question is to Senator Payne representing the Minister for Education.

Lee Rhiannon (NSW, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

That is correct.

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you. You have the call.

Lee Rhiannon (NSW, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I direct my question to the Minister representing Minister Pyne, Senator Payne. Considering when Minister Pyne first introduced the Higher Education and Research Reform Amendment Bill 2014 in August the cost savings associated with the bill were $3.9 billion and considering the latest version of the bill, introduced into the House of Representatives today, lists cost savings of $451 million, what other areas will be cut, as this bill was always about the budget bottom line?

Marise Payne (NSW, Liberal Party, Minister for Human Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

It has been confusing for many years having both Payne and Pyne in the parliamentary Liberal Party. I always used to say his family couldn't afford the vowel!

The senator's question in relation to the legislation really seems to me to miss the essential point of the government's proposals in relation to higher education. It is a reform bill. Reform is the purpose of the legislation. Many of the stakeholders who have participated in the debate over the recent many months that it has continued have expressed their disappointment today with the result of yesterday's vote.

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Minister Assisting the Leader for Science) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Not to me they haven't; they're delighted.

Marise Payne (NSW, Liberal Party, Minister for Human Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

They have expressed their disappointment today in press statements, in media interviews and in a number of other contexts. Perhaps they do not waste their time with someone who is not even prepared to entertain an intelligent argument. I do not know.

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Minister Assisting the Leader for Science) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

What are the students saying? What is the public saying?

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Carr, cease interjecting.

Marise Payne (NSW, Liberal Party, Minister for Human Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

What the stakeholders are saying—which has been continually ignored by those opposite—whether it is the regional universities, the network of innovative Australian universities, ACPET, CofFEE or the Group of Eight, all of those key operators of the higher education system in this country have expressed their disappointment with the result of yesterday.

What the government is committed to and continues to be committed to is giving greater opportunities to students—students that those opposite in particular have turned their back on, students who might want to study diplomas and receive Commonwealth support for doing it, students who might want to engage in a far greater range of courses than they are currently able to and receive Commonwealth support for doing it. (Time expired)

Lee Rhiannon (NSW, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, I ask a supplementary question. Minister, as you said the government is committed to students, why won't the government remove the threat of funding cuts and massive student fee hikes so the Australian parliament can start a conversation with the higher education sector and the Australian public on how to bring about a sustainable reform for the higher education sector, not your two-tier, inequitable system.

Marise Payne (NSW, Liberal Party, Minister for Human Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I think the Senator is quite right: I think those in this chamber should start a conversation with those in the sector who supported the reform. I think that would be a very good place to start—the people who actually run universities and colleges in this country, the people who run TAFEs and who run institutes which would allow tens of thousands more students to receive a higher education which they are currently not able to do with Commonwealth support. That is the sort of conversation you should be having. You are exactly right.

Lee Rhiannon (NSW, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, I ask a further supplementary question. Minister, can you put it on the line? Please explain how the latest version of the higher education cuts outline a saving of $451 million over the next four years but then lead to a dramatic saving of an additional $5.4 billion in the six years immediately following. Clearly this is still a budget bill.

Marise Payne (NSW, Liberal Party, Minister for Human Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Let me reiterate what I said earlier: this is a reform bill. This is about changing the Australian higher education system so that it is amongst the most competitive in the world so that our students can be in the most competitive higher education institutions in the world. The choice that we are faced with is the approach that was taken by those opposite—and you know this is the case, Senator Rhiannon—in which the years up to 2016-17 would have seen $6.6 billion worth of cuts out of the higher education sector. You know that is the case. What we are trying to do is maximise the opportunities for students, provide pathways for students from disadvantaged backgrounds, provide scholarship opportunities, enable students who are studying for diplomas and advanced diplomas to actually receive Commonwealth support for doing that for the first time ever. Every single peak body in higher education in this country supports these reforms.