Marielle Smith (SA, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Government Services, Senator Ruston. On Tuesday night the Minister for Government Services told the ABC's 7.30 program, 'Bank records, of course, are always available for seven years, and the department won't be going back after seven years, in terms of recovering that.' Is the government pursuing any debts from prior to 2013-14?

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Minister for Families and Social Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I thank the senator for her question. I'll take on notice the actual specifics, of the Minister for Government Services, in relation to the recovering of debt that is the overpayment of taxpayers' funds to Australians. I would also say to this chamber that in many instances the first thing that happens, when it comes to income compliance review—I hope you understand that. When you end up with a situation where we seek from somebody who is a recipient of a taxpayer funded payment to them, if there is a discrepancy that is identified between the records that we hold at the Department of Human Services and the records at the ATO and at the end of a period when we assess that, we will seek a discrepancy clarification—

Katy Gallagher (ACT, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I have a point of order on relevance. The question is very straightforward: is the government pursuing any debts prior to 2013-14? That is the question.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you. The minister has been speaking for a minute. I take the opportunity to remind the minister of the specific nature of the question. Senator Ruston.

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Minister for Families and Social Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you very much. I can confirm that the online compliance initiative does not go back past seven years. But in response to the question from Senator Smith, as I was saying, when a discrepancy has been identified between the information that an individual or a family has provided to the Department of Human Services and the ATO, we seek clarification from the individual as to whether there is a reason why that discrepancy exists. We do not raise a debt unless it has been formally identified in that process that the person has actually incurred a debt or has received moneys of which they weren't entitled. The very reason that we do this is the social welfare system in Australia is based on its sustainability, into the future, and that means that we make sure that people get what they are entitled to receive.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Smith, a supplementary question.

Marielle Smith (SA, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I refer the minister to 80-year-old Canberra woman Wilma Spence, who this month was hounded for $61.13 dating back to 1995. How many debts is the government pursuing that are more than seven years old?

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Minister for Families and Social Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Whilst I wouldn't normally comment on a particular case, the case to which Senator Smith refers, I can confirm that the Department of Human Services have advised me that they made an error and they have apologised for doing so.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Smith, a final supplementary question.

Marielle Smith (SA, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

When will the government finally admit that robo-debt, with its inaccuracies, cruel enforcement measures and a lack of human oversight, has failed?

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Minister for Families and Social Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I thank the senator for her follow-up question. Going back to my explanation of the process whereby we reconcile discrepancies that are identified with overpayments or potential overpayments, and where the individual has been contacted to explain why the overpayment has been made, if it is identified through that process that the person either does not have the debt—and this process, by the way, I point out, is a human-led review process. If it is identified the person does not have a debt, for reasonable reasons, then that person is not pursued. But we have an obligation, where overpayments occur, to sustain our social welfare system, to make sure that we provide people with the amount of money that they are entitled to receive. That is the basis of the sustainability of our system.