Tim Ayres (NSW, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I move:

That the Senate take note of the answers given by the Minister for Finance (Senator Birmingham) and the Minister for Foreign Affairs (Senator Payne) to questions without notice asked by Senators Ayres and Watt today relating to Australia’s relationship with China.

I thought that today's question time was pretty instructive. The strongest indication I think was when Senator Birmingham had an opportunity to signal a change in direction and an effort under his leadership to respond effectively to these questions of national interest, and I'm disappointed to see that the new leader in this place failed that test. It should have been a pretty easy test really. On one side, there's a national interest, and on the other side there's the partisan interest. It's manifestly in the national interest to call out the conduct of Senator Abetz, and it's manifestly in the national interest to call out the conduct of Senators Canavan, Christensen and Kelly in relation to their wild, unhelpful and reckless comments in relation to the whole host of issues that go to our relationship with China. So weak is Senator Birmingham's grip on the coalition caucus, so shallow his commitment to principle and to the national interest, that he squibbed it.

Australians of Chinese descent will be watching very closely. What they will see is that, for all the fundraising dinners, all of the nice words and all the grooming of members of the Chinese-Australian community, when push comes to shove the Liberals and Nationals will never stand for the Chinese-Australian community, not even when it's easy, not even when it's straightforward. It should be straightforward. What we heard was Minister Payne in here exhorting people in the Senate, other senators, to follow her example that the most important principle here was freedom of speech. Well, there are other principles that matter too—principles of responsibility, principles of leadership, principles of not being reckless when it comes to the national interest.

I thought that what Senator Payne said came very close to what we remember Senator Brandis saying, that everyone's got a right to be a bigot. People in this place have responsibilities. I say that Senator Abetz was wrong in his approach on the Foreign Affairs Committee for three reasons: (1) it was morally reprehensible, (2) what Senator Abetz said reinforces the Chinese Communist Party line that they are delivering to people of Chinese descent all around the world and in Australia, and (3) it reinforces the Chinese Communist Party government's propaganda line within China.

There is an important distinction here. I don't say that Senator Abetz is a racist. I disagree strongly with Senator Abetz, but I don't see him that way. But his conduct here is the result of assumptions that are driven by views about race. What he asked those three witnesses to do was unconditionally condemn the Chinese Communist Party dictatorship—despite its McCarthyist overtones. But at least Joe McCarthy asked everyone the same question; Senator Abetz only asked those witnesses—nobody else. They came with a genuine submission to this diaspora inquiry, talking about the issues of interference, the issues of dislocation, asking for a safe space for debate and support for their engagement but they had the door slammed in their face. Just when they were asking for tolerance and inclusion, they got the cold shoulder.

What Senator Abetz said reinforces the propaganda line that is taken by the government in China to Australians of Chinese descent. They say, 'You will never be accepted here'. We know this isn't true. We know that since the gold rush Chinese Australians have been a core part of the Australian story. But Senator Abetz sent the opposite message. People of good faith seeking inclusion were given the cold shoulder. Finally, sadly, Senator Abetz's message was a propaganda victory for the Chinese government in the context of the difficult issues we face in our relationship today. (Time expired)

Amanda Stoker (Queensland, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

There's an enormous immaturity on display in the way that we have heard Labor talk about Australia's relationship both with China and Australians of Chinese descent in question time today and in the froth and bubble of Senator Ayres's contribution a moment ago. In question time they started out by demanding apologies—the politics of condemnation—by finding a one-liner from a member of the government with which they disagree and trying to make that into something that can be extrapolated into itself being the source of jeopardy for the relationship between our two countries, and demanding that there be such a grovelling approach that one cannot even exercise one's right to speak in the way that Senator Abetz has. Then, in their third question, they went on the offensive on the question of foreign interference in a way that reflects that very insensitivity of which they accuse Senator Abetz. I've got to say, that reflects an awfully shallow understanding of the significance of the relationship between our two important countries.

Let me say this at the outset: those opposite build their arguments when it comes to the relationship between Australia and China on what is fundamentally an underestimation of the impressive and strong community of Australians of Chinese descent we have in this country. Australians of Chinese descent are valued members of the Australian community. They are avid entrepreneurs. They are champions of family business. They are people who value family. They value the freedoms we have in this country for many of them, and the very reason they value them is they don't have that privilege in the country from which they came.

When I go around in my home state of Queensland and talk to Australians of Chinese descent, they are so thankful for the freedoms that we have here—freedoms from many of the most abhorrent practices that we all know happen but often don't want to talk about happening in other countries, including in China—and they say 'thank you' for a government that is prepared to ensure that they are not the subject of intimidation. They are thankful for a government that is prepared to protect those from the diaspora who have made Australia home but who want to live by Australian values.

Can I tell you: I'm so proud of those Chinese Australians. They are wonderful contributors to this country. But let's not reduce what is a really serious issue—that is, the maintenance of an effective trading relationship in the interests of the ability of Australian producers through many industries, particularly in agriculture—to something that is a glib one-liner. We always need to stand true to Australia's values. And do you know what? This government has made it very clear, in the words of the Prime Minister, that Australia will always stand by its sovereignty and that Australia will always stand by its values, will always be consistent with those and will never trade them away. We will maintain our integrity whether it's in our foreign investment rules, in our rules about interference in Australia's political situations or about the integrity of our communications networks, and all those things. Do you know what? China does exactly the same thing. They protect their integrity of their systems according to their values, and they do it unapologetically.

Australia does the same. We act in the interests of Australians—today, tomorrow and every day of the week. We won't apologise for that. We will fight for it every day in the interests of the beef producer in Longreach Queensland as much as in the interests of the Australian baby formula exporter and as much as in the interests of the Australian iron ore producer. That is the honest, subtle truth of it.

Murray Watt (Queensland, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Minister for Northern Australia) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I think all Australians are watching with increasing dismay the escalation of what seems to be a serious trade dispute between Australia and China. Every day, we see increasing reports of restrictions from China on imports of Australian beef, barley, wine, coal, sugar and other products. These bans and these restrictions have particular significance in my home state of Queensland, given the volume of exports from Queensland to China and the number of jobs that hang off those exports.

To give you some sense of this, I just want to quickly quote from a report issued recently by Queensland economist Gene Tunny. He observes:

Queensland is obviously heavily exposed to trade restrictions from China … Queensland's annual goods exports to China of circa $25 billion amount to around 7% of our Gross State Product. Ongoing trade restrictions from China would cause major economic damage, especially in our regional economies such as Central Queensland and Mackay which are highly dependent on resources and agriculture. And, in the lead up to the 2020-21 Queensland Budget which Treasurer Dick—

that's Queensland treasurer Cameron Dick—

will hand down on 1 December, I should note that Chinese trade restrictions would be a big blow to our budget via impacts on royalties and other revenues such as payroll tax and stamp duty which would be lower due to the economic shock. Sure, our exporters may be able to find alternative markets in which to sell, but that will take time, and they may have to heavily discount their products to find non-Chinese buyers.

So this trade dispute is not just an academic exercise in my home state of Queensland. As Dr Tunny has observed, this has very real impact on Queensland's exports, on Queensland jobs, and on royalties that pay for services right around Queensland, in particular in regional economies such as Central Queensland and Mackay. That's why I have been so concerned to see some of the inflammatory rhetoric coming from LNP members of parliament and senators from Queensland. You would think that if anyone was passionate about making sure that Queensland jobs are protected and that Queensland exports grow rather than shrink it would be representatives in this chamber and in this parliament from Queensland.

I am not for a moment saying that we should be quiet about our concerns about our national interest or our values in relation to China or any other country. We should always speak up about our national interest. We should always protect our values. But this has to be done responsibly and maturely. As those figures that I have just pointed to demonstrate, there is too much on the line for reckless and inflammatory rhetoric. The responsible and mature approach is the approach that Labor have taken. We have consistently spoken up about concerns that we have regarding the human rights approach of China, around national security issues and around defence issues as well. Even just in the last few days we have expressed our concern about the escalating trade dispute with China and we have expressed our concern about what this might mean for Australian exporters and for Australian jobs. It is one thing to speak up responsibly and maturely about our values, our national interest and our defence concerns; it is another thing entirely to engage in the reckless and inflammatory rhetoric that we are increasingly seeing from members of this government. That is not going to help. That will not do anything to advance our national interests, it is not going to do anything to advance our values and it is certainly not going to do anything to protect Queensland jobs and Queensland exports.

So that's why you have to ask the question of why members of parliament like the member for Dawson, Mr Christensen, are going out there and saying in relation to the COVID-19 virus that:

… the CCP knowingly and deliberately allowed these "ambassadors of death" to infect the rest of the world.

Is that advancing our national interest in a mature and responsible fashion, or is that just recklessly going out and inflaming tensions, which has a practical consequence on Queensland jobs and Queensland exports? Similarly,

Senator Canavan has recently said:

If China buys less of our coal that means we will have some to build our own new HELE coal plants in Australia …

He's also gone on to say, 'All we're being asked to do is give up our access to cheap TVs.' This is a serious issue that deserves to be taken on responsibly and maturely. It doesn't deserve to be used as a way of generating Facebook likes which put Queensland jobs at risk. (Time expired)

Alex Antic (SA, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

We have heard conflations of words this afternoon in question time and afterwards that raise concerns from this side of the chamber. We've heard words bandied around such as 'McCarthyism' and 'recklessness'. I put to the chamber that, in fact, recklessness is conflating this issue into something that it is not. The fact of the matter is that China is our largest trading partner, and it is likely to remain so into the foreseeable future. That's because trade has brought mutual benefits and lifted hundreds of millions of people in the region out of poverty. As we emerge from this particularly difficult time in the COVID-19 pandemic, it is important that trade continues to be open, transparent and useful as a tool to economic recovery.

The Australian government, through its embassy in Beijing and its agencies in Canberra, has sought to clarify media reports of restrictions and unsubstantiated reports of possible bans on Australian products. Such reports, if true, would raise serious questions about compliance with trade rules and would be inconsistent with statements from the Chinese leadership—including those made last week at the China International Import Expo—on its commitment to open trade and the multilateral trading system. We in this government expect that China will continue its trade relationship with Australia in a manner consistent with its obligations.

Chinese authorities have confirmed increased testing of Australian live lobster imports, on which the Australian government had been urgently seeking clarification. Australia has strong regulatory controls that underpin the biosecurity, integrity and safety of our exports—safeguards that support our international reputation as a reliable exporter of safe, high-quality produce. The Australian government continues to expand trade opportunities for exporters, most recently through the CPTPP and trade agreements with Indonesia, Peru and Hong Kong. The PACER Plus will enter into force next month, and will expect to sign the regional comprehensive economic partnership agreement before the end of this year, as well as negotiating trade agreements with the EU, UK and the Pacific Alliance.

The issue regarding the number of our commodities and other exports is, of course, of great concern to the government and of great concern to those exporters. The Australian government has been standing by our exporters in ways this country has not seen in a long time, particularly during this difficult time of the pandemic. The 'technical issues', as they've been described by the Chinese government, will now be worked through. But, as the Prime Minister has said, Australia will stand by our sovereignty. We will always stand by our values, we will always be consistent with those and we will never trade them away. Whether it be the integrity of foreign investment rules, the integrity of rules of interference in political situations here in Australia or the integrity of communications networks, we will maintain that integrity. We will continue to raise our voice on matters that are important to the Australian people, and we will do that consistently, so that these things can't be traded away.

And there are matters of concern, which the Australian government has raised over and over again and will continue to do so, so that we stand by our values. As the Prime Minister has said, it is critical for Australia that we work this relationship in a way that's consistent with the comprehensive strategic partnership. It's an important partnership. We believe it's an important relationship, but it's a relationship that will always based on Australia's national interest and mutual benefit between Australia and China.

These deeply troubling rumours about trade relations are, in categories, as the trade minister has said, predominantly rumours which are unconfirmed and unsubstantiated, and people need to treat them in the manner in which they have been described. It is important for our exporters that we give them all the support that they require through these difficult times in their engagement with the Chinese authorities and their business counterparts on mainland China and other parts of China, including Hong Kong. The importers and customers who have had such a demand for— (Time expired)

Anthony Chisholm (Queensland, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I think we know who won the battle in here. Senator Birmingham clearly won the battle. He gave Senator Antic a slap down in his answer to the question in parliament today and then sent him out to take note here. We know that this is a very serious issue that Australians are anxious about, and it is something that is going to be of real consequence for Australian workers and, as Senator Watt said, Queensland workers. There is increasing anxiousness amongst Australians about the mismanagement of this important relationship.

So many businesses have geared up over time to do trade with China, and that is being put at risk because of the mismanagement of this government. There has been a lack of action from this government to fix up this relationship. There's been zero leadership from responsible ministers, and they've outsourced the relationship to the backbench. That has had real consequences for Australians. There's no better example of that than in the work that the member for Dawson, George Christensen, and Senator Canavan have been doing this year, which has undermined our relationship with China. It is having a real impact on Australian workers.

I want to take point with Senator Stoker's contribution, in which the senator accused us of immaturity. We are the ones who are treating this seriously, because we know how significant this is. It's the government backbenchers—the ones that are causing the trouble—that are putting this relationship at risk and doing further damage. It was rather astounding that the Leader of the Government in the Senate, Senator Birmingham, said that he was a steady hand on this issue. Nothing could be further from the truth. I think, if you look at the industries that have been impacted, they would say nothing other than that he has been a dead hand on this issue, because he is not taking this up to the government to fix these issues and is not in a leadership position to take advantage of that.

Last year, China accounted for a significant proportion of our exports, and they included barley, Queensland timber, wine, lobsters, sugar, coal, copper and meat. Behind these exports are some of the biggest employers that Queensland have, and they have been such a significant part of the export industry that we have seen develop over time. But already we are seeing that this is having consequences across Australia—in particular, in Queensland. Just on the radio last week I heard the CEO of Sirromet Wines, which is an iconic brand in Queensland and a place, particularly in Brisbane, that many people are aware of. They've been exporting 40 per cent of their wine to China, and that is being put at risk because of the mismanagement of this relationship by this government. We also know there have been reports in Mackay of the volume exported through the Hay Point terminal—the coal terminal—declining this year again. It puts jobs at risk, and it puts economic development at risk as well.

Business is rattled. They have been looking for leadership from the government, which has been so far found wanting. Workers are getting anxious. We know they are following these developments. They know that these sorts of repercussions have a direct impact on them, their livelihoods and their families, and the government is rudderless on this issue. You only have to look at the quote from Minister Birmingham in The Australian from a couple of days ago, where he said:

Continued uncertain and inconsistent messages from China are heightening risks and undermine the statements made by President Xi at this year's China International Import Expo.

He's saying that it's China's uncertain and inconsistent messages that are having an impact. What about the inconsistent messages from the government and their backbench? That is what is having an impact on this relationship, and it is something that is increasingly causing anxiousness amongst employers and businesses but also workers as well.

There's no doubt that the performance from Minister Birmingham today, for those who were able to see it, would not fill Australians with confidence. Australians understand the importance of this relationship. It is a complex one but it is an important one that we get right. So far, the government have completely mismanaged it and, under questions from the opposition today, you would have no confidence that they will be able to fix this relationship, which is such an important one for Australian businesses and Australian workers. It is important that the government show leadership on this issue and come to the Australians on this. (Time expired)

Question agreed to.