Louise Pratt (WA, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Assistant Minister for Manufacturing) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My question today is to the Minister for Senior Australians and Aged Care Services, Senator Colbeck. Lisa's father, 94-year-old Dick Lee, was allegedly abused at Regis Nedlands. A report details that they:

… found Mr Lee (who is always in a wheelchair) on the floor near the entrance of his room completely unclothed and sitting in his faeces with [a carer] standing over him. I asked [the carer], did he fall? and [the carer] replied with 'no'.

The carer was later witnessed dragging Mr Lee into the bathroom. More than 12 months after the royal commission's interim report, entitled Neglect, how is this neglect still continuing on this minister's watch?

Richard Colbeck (Tasmania, Liberal Party, Minister for Senior Australians and Aged Care Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thanks, Senator Pratt, for the question. I will continue to be cautious in the answer to this question with respect to what I say about the specifics of the allegations that have been made in this case, as I was in the question from Senator Sterle. These cases are subject to coroners' inquests. They're subject to independent review processes that have been commissioned and of course they have also been subject to a police investigation.

What I will say is that nobody in this place wants to see mistreatment of any senior Australian resident in aged care in this country. That is why we called the Royal Commission into Aged Care Quality and Safety, so that we could conduct a comprehensive review of the sector and we could put in place the appropriate regulatory regimes that support high-quality care for all senior Australians in the country.

Opposition Senator:

An opposition senator interjecting—

Senator Pratt interjecting—

Richard Colbeck (Tasmania, Liberal Party, Minister for Senior Australians and Aged Care Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I'll take the interjection from the other side. At the last budget, when we put billions of dollars into aged care, what did the opposition put in respect of aged care in their budget in reply? Not a single dollar. A lot of crocodile tears on the other side, but they have done nothing for decades.

Opposition senators interjecting—

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I didn't hear anything unparliamentary. Senator Wong, on a point of order.

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Leader of the Opposition in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

And to get into withdrawals, we also have crocodile tears, which impugns what we are asking when we're asking about neglect. However, I don't propose to go down that path. I'm raising an issue of direct relevance. The minister is asked—I'm sorry?

Honourable senators interjecting—

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order! Senator Wong has the call. Interjections are always disorderly and particularly unhelpful.

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Leader of the Opposition in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

If the senator wants to say that on his feet.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I missed something completely. Senator Wong, on the point of order.

Eric Abetz (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

She wants to be the centre of attention!

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Leader of the Opposition in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I don't, actually; I just want to make my point. Mr President, we're asking questions about some very serious allegations. There's one question that the minister has been asked, which is: how is the neglect continuing on his watch more than 12 months after he's received the royal commission report? I'd ask you to remind him of the question.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Wong, I believe the minister was being directly relevant and then responded to interjections, which was not being directly relevant. I will remind the minister of the question. I'll also remind people not to interject and therefore the distraction and the opportunity won't occur.

Richard Colbeck (Tasmania, Liberal Party, Minister for Senior Australians and Aged Care Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you, Mr President. With respect to the interim report and the COVID-19 report of the royal commission, the government has responded to both of those reports. We have continued to reform the sector—passing new legislation, which places additional responsibilities on the sector. The Serious Incident Response Scheme was passed through this place only last week, so we have continued to reform the sector while the royal commission has continued and we will continue to do so.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Birmingham, on a point of order?

Simon Birmingham (SA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I make a point of order in relation to conduct in the chamber and interjections. Senator Wong, in making her point of order before, demanded complete silence in the chamber before she spoke. Yet, since Senator Colbeck got back on his feet, Senator Wong has shown nothing but a lack of courtesy in listening to the answer and is showing a double standard in the behaviour she expected while she was on her feet.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

All interjections are disorderly.

Honourable senators interjecting—

Order! I'm going to ask that people stop the interjections while I talk. It's the end of a fortnight. I'm going to ask people to restrain themselves. I was attempting to call the chamber to order. I will start raising my voice if I need to. Interjections are not helpful and they are disorderly. Senator Pratt, a supplementary question?

Louise Pratt (WA, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Assistant Minister for Manufacturing) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

A few days after the alleged neglect, Mr Lee became ill, and his daughter's concerns that something was seriously wrong were dismissed. Mr Lee was eventually rushed to hospital, where he was in a coma. He had liver failure and died the next day. When did the minister first become aware of Mr Lee's tragic death, and what action has he taken to ensure this neglect never happens again?

Richard Colbeck (Tasmania, Liberal Party, Minister for Senior Australians and Aged Care Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Can I say this whole matter and the allegations that surround it are extremely distressing for us all. But the matter is not helped by questions from the opposition that leave out vital facts that are a part of this case.

Opposition Senators:

Opposition senators interjecting—

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Colbeck, please resume your seat. I can't hear the minister's answer. I need to be able to hear it. Senator Colbeck to continue.

Richard Colbeck (Tasmania, Liberal Party, Minister for Senior Australians and Aged Care Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you, Mr President. It is really disappointing that the opposition leaves out vital elements of what was even in the media this morning as part of their question to cast an impression that actually isn't true. The gentleman concerned was attended by a GP. This was not an act of the aged-care facility. So for the Labor Party to come in here and try and create the impression that it was is, quite frankly, completely dishonest. I've been very, very careful with respect to the circumstances of and the details that I put on the table with respect to these things and— (Time expired)

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Pratt, a final supplementary question?

Louise Pratt (WA, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Assistant Minister for Manufacturing) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

How many older Australians in residential aged care have died this year as a result of neglect?

Richard Colbeck (Tasmania, Liberal Party, Minister for Senior Australians and Aged Care Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Every person in this chamber would abhor any circumstance where a senior Australian has had that circumstance occur. Every single one of us would have that view. That is why this government called the royal commission, because we want to reform this sector in a way that provides high-quality care to senior Australians. That is our objection.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Gallagher, on a point of order?

Katy Gallagher (ACT, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My point of order is on relevance: the question was very direct. There was no preamble. It was: how many Australians in residential aged care have died this year as a result of neglect? I ask the minister to come to the answer to the question.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

You're quite right. I have previously ruled where there's a specific question that relates to the search for a fact, direct relevance will be applied very tightly. I call the minister to turn to the question.

Richard Colbeck (Tasmania, Liberal Party, Minister for Senior Australians and Aged Care Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

There have been, over the course of the last 12 months, a number of allegations of neglect in aged care and we're dealing with some of those as a part of the questions that we're being asked today.

Senator Polley interjecting—

Mr President, Senator Polley interjects and says they're more than allegations but that's exactly what they are; they are allegations at this point in time.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order! Senator Wong, on a point of order?

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Leader of the Opposition in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I repeat Senator Gallagher's point of order.

Scott Ryan (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

This was a specific factual question for which an answer can be provided or a discussion of the topic in question. I have previously ruled that, where there is no preamble or commentary or politically contestable terms, questions need to be taken strictly at their face value. Minister, I remind you of the question.

Richard Colbeck (Tasmania, Liberal Party, Minister for Senior Australians and Aged Care Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I have allegations of people who may have died of neglect but I have no direct evidence of anyone who has died of neglect. (Time expired)