Helen Polley (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

A letter has been received from Senator Thorpe:

Pursuant to standing order 75, I propose that the following matter of public importance be submitted to the Senate for discussion:

The continuing crisis of people dying in custody, in particular First Nations people, and the government's unwillingness to take urgent action and fully implement the recommendations of the 1991 Royal Commission into Aboriginal Deaths in Custody.

Is the proposal supported? There's only one person—

Lidia Thorpe (Victoria, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

If anyone cares about deaths in custody, please stand up. We need four people. Come on, Babet. Help me out.

Helen Polley (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

There are not four people standing—

More than the number of senators required by the standing orders having risen in their places—

With the concurrence of the Senate, the clerks will set the clock in line with the informal arrangements made by the whips.

Lidia Thorpe (Victoria, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

First Nations deaths in custody are a national crisis. In 1991 we had a royal commission into Aboriginal deaths in custody, yet here we are, 32 years later, more than a generation later, and more and more of our people are dying in custody instead of there being an end to this crisis. When I first walked into this chamber, I carried this message stick, engraved with one line for each death in custody since the royal commission, which was supposed to put an end—

Helen Polley (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Thorpe, you know very well that we don't allow props to be used in the chamber. I would ask you—

Lidia Thorpe (Victoria, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I was allowed to bring it in when I walked in to be sworn in—

Helen Polley (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

That was when you walked in.

Lidia Thorpe (Victoria, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

There were 441 deaths in custody when I walked into this place.

Helen Polley (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Thorpe, I ask you to be seated.

Lidia Thorpe (Victoria, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Now we've got over 500.

Helen Polley (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Thorpe, are you going to continue?

Lidia Thorpe (Victoria, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Yes. Can I continue?

Helen Polley (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

You can continue.

Lidia Thorpe (Victoria, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

That stick, when I walked in here, had 441 deaths in custody on it. Now we have over 540 deaths in custody. At least back in 1991 this got public attention—but not now. Nobody wants to know about it, even though Labor's own father of reconciliation, Senator Dodson, has called the government out about its inaction. In the last three decades, we have seen government after government letting us down, clearly showing that they don't care. You didn't care, and now you don't care. Each and every one of those lives matter to us and to many people. Some of those people whose lives you threw away were not even sentenced or held for even minor offences, as was the case with Tanya Day, who was arrested because she put her feet on the train seat. She died because she put her feet on the train seat! A whitefella wouldn't be arrested for that.

Labor and the coalition are in a race to the bottom to be tough on crime. However, we all know that social factors are first and foremost in determining crime rates. Most of the recommendations of the royal commission were about social factors to make sure that our people are not being left behind. Every government comes up with new buzzwords on how they are going to deal with black people in this country—'closing the gap'—and they introduce advisory body after advisory body, yet there are no changes on the ground.

More of our people are being incarcerated, more people are dying in custody and more of our people are taking their lives. I talk to blackfellas in prisons, and they tell me about the hanging points. They tell me exactly where the hanging points are in the prison cells. The recommendation talks about the hanging points in these cells, and these young men are telling me where they are and how they tell each other how to hang themselves! You can't blame them; what does their future look like in this country? The system knows about these hanging points, but nothing is being done; it isn't a problem if another one of us dies. Worst of all are the privately operated prisons—those operated by the criminal Serco, which the government loves having on board and paying. Serco are the real criminals here; they're the ones hurting and killing our people. All this is allowed because there is still wide-ranging systemic racism in this country. It's in all institutions, but first and foremost in the police. Police violence against First Nations people is off the chart in this country.

All your voices to parliament and all your closing the gap Garmin statements are all worth nothing, because you ain't saving our people's lives in this country. So do it! Get the 339 recommendations from the royal commission that this country paid for and implement them now. Black lives matter in this country! Stop killing us! (Time expired)

Kerrynne Liddle (SA, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The last project I worked on directly before being elected to the Senate was to put in place a custody notification service in South Australia for the Aboriginal Legal Rights Movement, ALRM. The custody notification service, CNS, provides round-the-clock support to Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people taken into custody by the police. The service required police to notify ALRM as soon as practicable after arrest that they had an Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander person in custody. The benefits were to assist police in discharging their duty of care and in reducing risk for everyone. The service facilitated communication between the arrested person and ALRM, which provided an holistic wellbeing check and, basically, got advice and communication with police for those who were held with or without charge. It was a simple step in reducing preventable deaths in custody and related harm.

One of the saddest stories I've heard was from the NT a few years ago, when a woman was taken into custody after police responded to a domestic and family violence report; a baby, left behind, died. The CNS discloses issues related to medication and/or mental health issues, or personal issues that might create risk for a person held in custody and/or others. It was funded by the coalition while in government, and the NIAA website advises that an evaluation to determine the effectiveness of CNS is underway to identify the gaps and opportunities for improvement. It has been that way since September 2022, and I very much look forward to finding out what the future of CNS is.

I want to talk about the fastest-growing cohort of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people in custody: it's women. Although Indigenous Australians make up 3.2 per cent of the general population, they make up around 32 per cent of all prisoners. The Australian Law Reform Commission suggests that the rate at which Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander women are imprisoned is a reflection of the multiple and layered nature of disadvantage they face—they are the links between entrenched disadvantage, including social, cultural and economic forms, and increased rates of criminal justice contact. These are well established and must also be tackled.

This is the reason why I argue so strongly for improving expectations, performance and accountability of service provision everywhere, because improving these outcomes will provide the foundations for people to build their own lives and their own futures. Where these fail to deliver as they should, the people who rely on them struggle. The Law Reform Commission provides evidence that Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander women are frequent victims of crime, particularly interpersonal or violent crime. Female Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander prisoners are likely to have been victims of crime themselves, particularly family violence and sexual abuse.

When I was in Alice Springs recently, I went to visit the Alternative to Custody Life Skills Camp run by the Drug and Alcohol Services Australia organisation. There I met a number of women—young women, mothers—who were behind a high fence and wearing ankle bracelets, and who generously and confidently shared their stories, hopes and desires for building a better and different future on release. They explained how their decision to participate in the alternative to custody program enabled them to live in a 10-unit complex, learning cooking skills, literacy and numeracy and getting relevant support from counsellors. It's a six-month program, a community model to address behaviour, and it recognises cultural and individual needs and values. Women can self-refer or they can come directly from custody.

The women shared that their greatest fear on leaving custody was finding housing that would support them to maintain a stable home from which to anchor and rebuild their lives and the lives of their families. They were also concerned about remaining safe and free from the of domestic and family violence. While addressing deaths in custody is important, it is equally important to focus on prevention. That means children going to school, the expectation of parents to send those children to school, teachers who are focused on high expectations for those children because they turn up to learn and opportunity for reward and training in a job when they finish learning, to ensure they are on a much more positive life trajectory. It's quite simply not complex and it's not too much to ask us.

Patrick Dodson (WA, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Any death in custody should concern us all. It's clear that the number of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples dying in custody is a sad matter for families and reminds governments that things need to change. I was a commissioner of the Royal Commission into Aboriginal Deaths in Custody, which reported more than 30 years ago. More than 500 Aboriginal people have died in custody since that time. That is a statistic that I know unsettles us all. As the royal commission found after its exhaustive four years of inquiry, it's not that the death rates of Aboriginal people are higher than that of non-Aboriginal people in custody; it's the rate at which they are taken into custody that leaves Aboriginal people so grossly not only overrepresented in our prison populations but vulnerable to deaths in custody.

What's the root cause of this dreadful statistic? There are simply too many Aboriginal people being locked up. Imprisonment should be the measure of last resort, as the royal commission said. The Productivity Commission reported last year that First Nations people are 13.5 times nor likely to be imprisoned than non-Indigenous Australians. First Nations people make up only 3.8 per cent of the Australian population but represent 32 per cent of the adult prison population. These figures are completely unacceptable.

There have been dreadful examples of neglect and abuse in our state and territory criminal justice systems, in lock-ups and prisons and in custody more generally. It's long been my position that those who have responsibility for care and supervision of people in custody must be held to account. I was particularly disturbed by the findings earlier this year by the Victorian coroner, who inquired into the horrific death of the lady who died in spite of having sought help from custodial officers more than 30 times. I do note that the coroner found that, if all the recommendations of the royal commission had been implemented, her death would have likely been avoided.

But I reject the premise of this matter of public importance—that the government of which I'm a part is unwilling to take action. We are serious about reducing the number of First Nations people going to jails. That's why in October's budget last year we committed $99 million to fund First Nations justice packages. Of that money, $81.5 million will be invested in up to 30 community-led justice reinvestment programs across the country. We've already identified two priority sites for early intervention: Alice Springs and Halls Creek.

We want to build on the success of initiatives like in Bourke, New South Wales. There the Aboriginal community has worked with governments and service providers with great success to support local initiatives. That's what's going to have to happen across the country if we're going to meet the justice targets under the National Agreement on Closing the Gap for both adults and youth. Of course, this is not the only approach required if we are to make progress.

In our federal system, many of the levers of change sit with states and territories. They are the ones with control of the police, the prisons and the health care that is provided within them. National leadership is critical. The previous government was intent on abdicating responsibility back to states and territories. This government will not shirk its duties. This government has reinstated the Standing Council of Attorneys-General and made Indigenous justice a standing agenda item. It's working with states and territories to develop a proposal to raise the minimum age for criminal responsibility. It's funding, for the first time, legal representation for families at coronial inquests. And it's advancing real-time reporting of deaths in custody to ensure better accountability across the country. We need to keep First Nations people out of jails and out of lock-ups. That's our goal, and we're determined to achieve it.

Dorinda Cox (WA, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

On behalf of the Australian Greens, I rise to speak in this MPI debate on deaths in custody. As a First Nations woman, I know all too well about the unacceptable rates of deaths in custody in Australia's history and also at present, particularly being from Western Australia, which has the highest number of First Nations deaths in custody. I want to acknowledge the families and the descendants from the town of Roebourne in Western Australia, my home state, which was the catalyst for the royal commission after the death of John Pat.

We don't know exactly how many First Nations people have died in custody since the 1991 royal commission, because it just keeps happening. But we do know that more than 520 First Nations people have died in custody in the last 30 years. I want to take a moment to acknowledge those 520 families and communities that have lost loved ones, taken from them all too soon. My heartfelt thoughts are always with them as we continue to do this work. In itself an unnecessary and cruel lack of action has resulted in their loss. Unfortunately this is not a new issue either. I mentioned earlier the 1991 royal commission into deaths in custody, which produced a list of 339 recommendations, at least 36 per cent of which have not been fully implemented.

We've got a report. What do we need to do now? Why aren't we doing it? It's absolutely shameful. The Greens have continually called for Medicare in prisons. Coroners have stated that this could help reduce deaths in custody. Our deaths while in custody are from health conditions which are in fact treatable, meaning that many deaths are entirely preventable if there is adequate, community controlled and culturally appropriate health care available in custody. Identifying presenting health issues and maintaining people's health whilst they are in prison is vitally important in playing a key role in preventing deaths in custody.

I want to finish by speaking about my time as a police officer in the Western Australian Police. During this time I was responsible for transporting, caring for and processing people in custody. The continuum of this care is important to contextualise and understand the fundamental human rights frameworks based on the UN human rights principles for people in custody. These include:

All prisoners shall be treated with the respect due to their inherent dignity and value as human beings.

There shall be no discrimination on the grounds of race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status.

An example of this is the requirement for police officers to conduct cell checks every 20 minutes unless they get an alarm raised for whatever issue may be presented to them. A clear example of that is the case of Ms Dhu. Everyone has the right to be treated with humanity, dignity and respect, and this includes people who are in custody, regardless of time, place and circumstance. But, unfortunately, this is not the case for First Nations people. (Time expired)

Nita Green (Queensland, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I rise to speak briefly on this matter of public importance on deaths in custody. I thank the speakers who've contributed to this debate and I particularly acknowledge my colleague Senator Dodson. He asked me to speak on this important matter. I do so acknowledging his longstanding work in Aboriginal affairs, particularly as director of the Kimberley Land Council, and, of course, in relation to this important matter, as commissioner of the Royal Commission into Aboriginal Deaths in Custody. It's clear that there's been little to no change in some of the facts and figures that have been cited by those in this debate. This is a case of national shame and a case of national tragedy.

On this side of the chamber, we are certainly not sitting on our hands, ignoring Senator Dodson and his calls for action or ignoring those in the community who want to see change. First Nations deaths in custody are a national shame and a major marker of the gap between Indigenous and non-Indigenous Australians. They cause devastating, intergenerational trauma for families and community. I live in Far North Queensland, and it's fair to say that deaths in custody in our region have formed part of the identity of communities, and the tragedy of communities. I speak without naming the person in the death in custody in 2004 on Palm Island, which caused so much heartache and despair in that community.

Our government is listening to communities about taking steps, something that the previous government failed to do. The government is absolutely committed to addressing the ongoing tragedy of First Nations deaths in custody. It is completely uncalled for and inappropriate for those opposite or anyone in this chamber to insinuate that this government is ignoring these recommendations or even the royal commission itself.

As the royal commission has made clear, there are many reasons that Indigenous deaths in custody occur, but, of course, the main reason is that the rates of incarceration in the Indigenous community are so high. Too many young Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people, in particular, are being robbed of their futures by a system that has completely let them down. First Nations people are 13 times more likely to be imprisoned, making up to 30 per cent of the adult prison population but only two per cent of the Australian population. Certainly, we know that young Indigenous people make up a major proportion of people in juvenile detention.

Our government is taking steps. That's why we've invested $81.5 million in 30 community led justice reinvestment initiatives across Australia. We're establishing an independent national justice reinvestment unit. This was a recommendation from the Australian Law Reform Commission, and we are putting it in place. This is the largest funding package in justice reinvestment ever committed by the Commonwealth. Justice reinvestment will involve a community led and holistic approach to keeping at-risk individuals out of the criminal justice system in the first place. It's such an important step to be taken. Justice reinvestment is something the former government failed to do, and we are righting that wrong by investing in this important strategy for First Nations people. These projects will address the underlying socioeconomic drivers that increase First Nations people's risk of contact with the criminal justice system, by working with local communities on local solutions. That really is key to achieving any type of reform or change in this policy area or space: working with local communities. We need to listen to what the solutions are on the ground, and we need to implement those solutions. That's why existing justice reinvestment programs have been proven to deliver record reduced incarceration, reduced crime and reduced recidivism. It is incredibly important that these programs are supported, and we seek that support from those across the chamber.

Malcolm Roberts (Queensland, Pauline Hanson's One Nation Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

If we want real solutions to our country's problems, we must deal with facts. With deaths in custody, the data shows there is no crisis. The rate of deaths in custody has been steady for around 20 years, at around half it's early-nineties peak. These are indisputable data from the Australian Institute of Criminology, the government agency tasked especially with monitoring deaths in custody. Adjusted for population, non-Indigenous prisoners were twice as likely to die in prison than Indigenous prisoners. Yes, you heard that right. If you are not an Indigenous person, you are twice as likely to die in prison than an Indigenous prisoner. Due to the small numbers, deaths in police custody fluctuate from year to year. The data on Indigenous deaths in custody per Indigenous population has drastically reduced since the nineties and has remained steady at this low rate for nearly 20 years. The real crisis is male deaths in prison. On a population adjusted basis in the last reported year, men were 60 per cent more likely to die in prison than women.

David Shoebridge (NSW, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The sickening regularity of deaths of First Nations people in custody is cause for national shame. It's indeed cause for international condemnation of our country, our government and this place. More than 540 First Nations people have died in custody since 1991. This is not an accident. First Nations deaths in custody are the product of a racist criminal justice system which overpolices First Nations communities, of systematic disadvantage, of courts that are more likely to send First Nations people to prison and of prisons that are unsafe in structural and systemic ways. And all these, as Senator Cox made clear, are the result of political decisions by parties in this place who won't stand up when powerful police associations demand more powers and more resources, and by those who are more interested in funding new prisons and new cells than programs to support communities or even in listening to communities in the first place.

The Royal Commission into Aboriginal Deaths in Custody was announced in 1987, more than 35 years ago, and it was in response to the shocking and awful deaths of First Nations people, including 16-year-old John Pat from WA, who died in a police cell in 1983. John Pat was brutally murdered by police, who beat him to death outside of a police station, and no-one has ever been found guilty of his murder. In fact, in the 234 years since the invasion of this land, not a single prison officer has been convicted for a black death in custody. This is why the common chant at First Nations rallies rings across this country and rings so true: 'They say accident. We say murder.'

The royal commission made crucial recommendations to make prisons less dangerous, an obvious one being the removal of hanging points in cells—a simple matter to undertake, you would think, when we're seeing billions and billions of dollars spent on new and expanded prisons. But, 32 years later, there are thousands and thousands of prison cells in this country that still contain hanging points, where desperate people can and do hang themselves. So, when we're told by the former government or by this government that it's fixed, that the recommendations have been implemented, it's a downright lie, and it's a lie that is killing First Nations people.

The lack of proper medical care in prisons is also a deadly assault. It's a deadly assault on First Nations inmates. Our supposedly universal healthcare system literally stops at the doors of a prison and often, therefore, fails to meet those who most urgently need help—like Douglas Shillingsworth, who died in a New South Wales prison following an ear infection. 'Mootijah' means 'the strong one', which was his name in Murrawarri language. He was killed by an ear infection, because of inadequate care. We need to urgently put Medicare into prisons, and we need that Medicare delivered by Aboriginal controlled health organisations so it delivers the culturally safe care that First Nations people need. (Time expired)