Bob Baldwin (Paterson, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Defence Science and Personnel) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

On indulgence: it has been over 36 years since Australia’s involvement in the Vietnam War came to an end. Yet the Vietnam War remains remarkably fresh in the minds of many Australians. The recent news that the final two Australian missing-in-action airmen from the Vietnam War have been discovered and identified has served to refresh the national conscience on the events of a war fought almost four decades ago. I rise today to pass on my condolences to those who survive Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver and to thank these brave airmen for the sacrifice that they made on behalf of a now grateful nation

Yesterday, as part of the Vietnam Veterans Remembrance Day commemorations, I gave a speech to the local Vietnam Veterans sub-branch in Forster that focused on the need to redefine the Australian history of the Vietnam War. I spoke on that specific subject as I believe that the current version of the Vietnam War that the average Australian will recount is based on the American experience in Vietnam. This account of the Vietnam War does not reflect the Australian story in Vietnam—a situation that I believe should be changed. So, as I speak today of the final two missing-in-action airmen found in Vietnam, I do so hoping that their story, like the stories of the other four missing-in-action personnel, will become a part of the Australian narrative of the Vietnam War. I hope that their story will become our story.

When Australia’s involvement in Vietnam ceased in 1973, four Australian diggers and two airmen remained behind. I choose my words very carefully in saying that they remained behind, for no Australian soldier, airman or sailor would ever willingly leave a mate behind. This is an extremely important point to make, not just because it is part of the Australian military ethic but because all of our current serving soldiers need to know that, if the worst should happen, their mates will do everything within their capacity to bring them home and that they will not be left behind.

The men who were unable to be recovered when Australia left Vietnam in 1973 were: Private Peter Gillson and Lance Corporal Richard Parker, whose bodies were unable to be recovered at the time of the battle owing to the heavy weight of enemy fire; Lance Corporal John Gillespie, whose remains were unable to be recovered due to the intense enemy activity in the area where the helicopter he was riding in was shot down; Private David Fisher, whose body was buried by enemy soldiers after he fell from a rope beneath a Royal Australian Air Force helicopter during a hot extraction of his patrol in the eastern Long Khanh province about 30 kilometres from Nui Dat; and, of course, Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver, whose aircraft disappeared on the night of 3 November 1970 on its way back home after completing its mission.

On 30 July this year, after extensive research, forensic examination and many expeditions into rugged terrain, the remains of Flying Officer Herbert and Pilot Officer Carver were discovered and positively identified, thus ending the search for our Vietnam missing-in-action soldiers and airmen. Flying Officer Michael Herbert was just 24 years old when his Canberra bomber was lost. From Glenelg in South Australia, he joined the No .2 Squadron in February 1970 and was the pilot of Magpie 91. Flying Officer Herbert, who had qualified as a pilot at the age of 16, was a veteran of 198 operational sorties over Vietnam and only had two months to go until he finished his tour of duty. Pilot Officer Robert Carver was also 24 years of age. He was a navigator on Magpie 91 and served for only eight weeks in Vietnam, during which time he had conducted 33 sorties. Pilot Officer Carver was from Toowoomba in Queensland and joined No. 2 Squadron in September 1970. Magpie 91, as their Canberra bomber was known, disappeared off the radar screens on the night of 3 November 1970 on its way back home after completing its mission. It was rediscovered in April this year in thick jungle on a hillside in remote Quang Nam province, near the border between Vietnam and Laos. Since the discovery of the aircraft in April, research teams have been working hard to identify the two airmen.

I would like to make special mention of the work carried out by the RAAF investigation team, the Defence Science and Technology Organisation and the Army History Unit for their tireless efforts in discovering the aircraft’s location and identifying the lost airmen. I would also like to acknowledge the support afforded to them by former members of the North Vietnamese army, former Vietcong soldiers and local Vietnamese villagers. Finally, I would like to acknowledge the work of Jim Bourke and Peter Aylett, whom I understand were responsible for the ‘Aussies Home’ website and put in countless hours of work in attempting to discover the whereabouts of Private Peter Gillson, Lance Corporal Richard Parker, Lance Corporal John Gillespie, Private David Fisher, Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver—all of this work so that our MIAs could finally come home.

The finding of these six missing men, all  killed in action, has reminded Australians of the risks that our soldiers faced every day when they were in Vietnam. It has also reminded us of all the terrible hardships encountered by our solders’ families not only during the war but long after the final round has been fired. The research into, and the discovery of, the last six Australians who were missing in action in Vietnam for almost 40 years is testament to the Australian spirit and untouchable qualities of mateship. Yet, as important as this discovery is for the nation’s conscience, their repatriation will touch no hearts more than those of their families. For the anguish that a family must feel when they are faced with not knowing the fate of their brother, son, father or uncle must truly be unbearable. For these heroes’ families, the repatriation finally brings closure on a much tormented chapter of their lives and now they can move on knowing that their loved ones are finally home where they belong. And although we must wait for the repatriation of Flying Officer Herbert and Pilot Officer Carver—due to take place later this month—their identification is already having an impact here in Australia.

I was reminded some time ago that six wristbands were presented to the National Vietnam Veterans Museum by a United States MIA organisation. Each wristband had a name plate with the name of the Australian MIA and was designed to be closed when the MIA was found. With the discovery of Flying Officer Herbert and Pilot Officer Carver the last two MIA wristband name plates have now been closed, and along with them, a long open chapter in Australian military history.

I would like to conclude with a very simple verse written by Private Gary McMahon 6 RAR, Vietnam. I came across this verse on the order of service of the repatriation service on 26 July for our latest digger killed in action, Private Benjamin Ranaudo. I believe that it accurately portrays the Australian experience and spirit during the Vietnam War, and it reads:

We would do anything for a mate,

anything except leave him on the battle field.

We shared our last drops of water and our last cigarette.

We patrolled together, we slept together, we laughed together, we fought together, we even died together.

Each of the four soldiers who were unable to be brought home at the time Australia left Vietnam has now been, or very shortly will be, repatriated. As I said, shortly, Flying Officer Herbert and Pilot Officer Carver will be returned to their native land. Of course, that is why I rise today, to pay respect to these two airmen—for their service, their sacrifice, their bravery, and for their patience, for it has been nearly 40 years since they were last on Australian soil.

Greg Combet (Charlton, Australian Labor Party, Minister Assisting the Minister for Climate Change) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

It is a privilege for me, also, to speak today about the discovery of the Canberra bomber containing the remains of our last two missing Australian Defence Force personnel from the Vietnam conflict—Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver.

On 3 November 1970, Flying Officer Herbert and Pilot Officer Carver disappeared approximately 65 km south-west of Da Nang in Quang Nam Province while returning to base following a bombing mission, leaving very little information available about what had happened to them. It was only for the efforts of many expert researchers and concerned people that this discovery was made possible. Flying Officer Michael Herbert was 24 years old when the Canberra bomber was lost. He was the pilot of Magpie 91 and was a veteran of no less than 198 operational sorties over Vietnam. Flying Officer Herbert joined No. 2 Squadron in February 1970 and was from Glenelg in South Australia.

Pilot Officer Robert Carver was also only 24 years of age. He was the navigator on Magpie 91 and had conducted 33 sorties in Vietnam. Pilot Officer Carver joined No. 2 Squadron in September 1970 and he came from Toowoomba, Queensland.

An inquiry conducted in late 1970 was unable to determine the cause of the incident from the available evidence. In October 2008 the Chief of Air Force requested the Australian Army History Unit investigate the aircraft’s disappearance, due to their experience in resolving four cases of Australian soldiers who were unaccounted for from the Vietnam War. The initial investigation team conducted a complete record search from Australia and then undertook reconnaissance in Vietnam in January this year, during which they conducted many interviews with veterans, government officials and locals from the surrounding villages in Quang Nam province.

This information led to a team of specialists deploying on a reconnaissance mission to Vietnam in April of this year. Deep in rugged and remote terrain of Quang Nam province near the Laotian border, this team made the initial discovery of the Canberra bomber crash site. While no human remains were found at that time—the group was ill equipped for an appropriate search—a number of military artefacts were found, including a club badge which was unique to Herbert and Carver’s RAAF No. 2 Squadron.

The team deployed again to the crash site in July of this year in an operation appropriately named Operation Magpies Return, in honour of the call sign of the crashed aircraft. This team in July included forensic odontologists, a forensic anthropologist, a forensic pathologist, an archaeologist, an air crash investigator, the principal investigator, an explosive ordnance technician, a photographer and a civilian engineer. I was pleased to announce on 30 July in my portfolio capacity that the team was successful in uncovering the remains of our two final missing ADF personnel from Vietnam.

The discovery of the remains of Flying Officer Herbert and Pilot Officer Carver closes the final chapter in our quest to recover the remains of all of our Australian Defence Force personnel missing in Vietnam, which had been six in total. This follows the discovery and recovery in recent times of four of our soldiers, Private David Fisher, Lance Corporal Richard Parker, Private Peter Gillson and Lance Corporal John Gillespie. At the end of this month we will repatriate the remains of our final two missing ADF members. This means that all personnel lost in Vietnam will have been brought home and laid to rest in their home country.

There were many people involved and I would like to take this opportunity to congratulate them all for their efforts, because it has been an extraordinary team effort. Firstly, I thank Operation Aussies Home, which has always been a very strong advocate for the return of Australian personnel from the Vietnam conflict. I commend the organisation for that commitment, especially Mr Jim Burke, who has played a driving role in Operation Aussies Home. The Australian Army History Unit’s expertise and exhaustive research also contributed dramatically to unravelling the 40-year mystery of what happened to Herbert and Carver. The Defence Science and Technology Organisation also played a key role in offering precise modelling techniques that allowed what was an extremely large search area to be effectively refined and narrowed. This played a key role in aiding the discovery.

The cooperation and assistance the government received from the Vietnamese government during this mission has been extremely important. I make particular mention of the Vietnamese ministry of defence missing in action department, which facilitated the recovery team’s work in Vietnam. Without their assistance the discovery and recovery action could not have been effected. Interviews with local Vietnamese people and Vietnamese veterans were also crucial in understanding the fate of the aircraft and the identification of the site. Their support and assistance was overwhelming and we are enormously grateful to them.

In conclusion, we thank also the Royal Australian Air Force and the recovery team they sent in on two very difficult missions to locate the remains in a very rugged and dense part of Vietnam. Finally, to the families of Flying Officer Herbert and Pilot Officer Carver I would like to pass on my personal and sincere condolences. I hope that the families find some comfort in the knowledge that their loved ones have been found and that they will be brought home and laid to rest in Australia.

This brings to a close an enormously important chapter in the history of Australia’s engagement in the Vietnam War. Of course it was a divisive issue politically in this country in the 1960s and early 1970s and unfortunately—and this is important, bearing in mind that yesterday was Vietnam Veterans Day—our Vietnam veterans did not receive the respect and recognition across the community in those days that they deserved. It is extremely important now that we have found the last two missing ADF members in Vietnam that this respect and honour are extended to Flying Officer Herbert and Pilot Officer Carver and that we can close this particular chapter in our history with dignity. Thank you.

Luke Simpkins (Cowan, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

As a former Army man it is a very rare occasion that I get the opportunity to speak of the members of the Royal Australian Air Force. In reading the history of No. 2 Squadron and the work undertaken by Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver, I see that there is a great need to speak of them and to speak of the exploits of No. 2 Squadron.

Back in April, as has been previously described by other speakers, a very old mystery was resolved with the finding of Magpie 91, the Canberra bomber that was lost on 3 November 1970 with the loss of Flying Officer Herbert and Pilot Officer Carver. It was found in Quang Nam province not far off route from the mission that they undertook on that night. The finding of the aircraft has served to solve that mystery. Then not long ago, in July, came the confirmation in Hanoi of the identity of the remains of the two servicemen in the wreckage. As sad and tragic as it is that the lives of these young men are confirmed as being lost on that night, I am sure that it gives some sense of relief to their families, both in Glenelg, the origin of Flying Officer Herbert, and in Toowoomba for the family of Pilot Officer Carver.

I would like to make some comments with regard to No. 2 Squadron. No. 2 Squadron was a highly regarded element of the Royal Australian Air Force and that respect stretched across not just Australia but also our US allies during the Vietnam War. We first got Canberra bombers back in 1953 and they were built under licence from the UK. We started building Canberra bombers and the first one flew in 1953. Despite the fact that reports from 1970 described the Canberras as ‘ageing bombers’, it is odd that it was only in 1982 that they were finally retired. I believe that No. 2 Squadron had them for the entire time that they served this country.

However, it was in 1967 that No. 2 Squadron, having had some active service in the Malayan Emergency, had their advance party and then finally flew into Phan Rang Air Base, a US built air force base about 250 kilometres from Saigon. As part of the 35th Tactical Fighter Wing, No. 2 Squadron served with our American allies, and within the history of the squadron there are a great number of records of the courage, dedication and effectiveness of the pilots of No. 2 Squadron.

Apparently, when the squadron first got to Vietnam the Americans were very keen to have Australian pilots and an Australian squadron with them. The American concept of bombing was that they very much liked level bombing to occur during nights and they could not understand after the Australians had been there for a short time that the Australians wanted to do daylight level bombing. So they pursued that and from 1967 to 1971, the time that they were in Vietnam, there is no doubt that bombing was predominantly done at night, and there are some records of the great work that the No. 2 Squadron did during their daylight bombing sorties.

Apparently the Tactical Fighter Wing was very appreciative of having No. 2 Squadron with them. It has been calculated that, of the total damage claimed to have been inflicted by the 35th  Tactical Fighter Wing during this period of the war, No. 2 Squadron was responsible for 16 per cent and yet they only conducted only five or six per cent of the sorties. So what we have found is that the Australians, from a craft and professionalism perspective, were very accurate and they were very well regarded as a result.

They normally bombed from fairly high levels, and I believe on the night of the loss of Magpie 91 that they were meant to be bombing at the higher levels. But records of No. 2 Squadron describe them going as low as 800 metres. That is exceedingly courageous because at 800 metres anti-aircraft guns are highly effective, but accuracy improves at lower heights and there are a number of records of those on the ground, the Australian trainers, the US forces and the Australian forces, who appreciated the efforts and the danger that No. 2 Squadron went to in fighting the fight and providing close air support and tactical bombing.

There is another story of when the squadron attacked at 800 metres. After the aircraft landed they found that fragments from the bomb that the aircraft had dropped had come back up from the explosion on the ground and done some fairly serious damage to the aircraft, so they were a little bit more careful about the low level bombing after that. But it just goes to show that they were very courageous people and they did an excellent job whilst they were over there.

General Westmoreland, who was the officer in charge of all forces in Vietnam, made some comments about No. 2 Squadron. He said:

The RAAF has an elite Canberra Squadron which has impressed me very much. Its discipline is superb and there is obviously a very high esprit de corps within the Squadron.

That certainly shows that No. 2 Squadron was highly regarded.

On 3 November 1970 the Magpie 91, with Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver on board, departed Phan Rang airfield at 7 pm. They reached their target and dropped their bombs in Quang Nam province at 8.22 pm, and it was reported that there was no radio contact after 10.15 pm. I have done some reading on this matter and maybe I am speculating on this, but it has been reported that the loss of the aircraft was as a result of some major problem, an explosion, that rendered the aircraft no longer able to fly.

There was some suggestion that this was as a result of one of the bombs not dropping properly. With the Canberra bombers, there were four 750-pound bombs—this is a classic Vietnam bomb load for Canberras—in the bomb bay area and then another 750-pound bomb on each wing. Given the fact that the bombs were dropped at 8.22 pm and it was some time after that that radio contact was lost, it would suggest that it would be unlikely that some fault with the bomb-dropping mechanisms would have been responsible for the explosion which ultimately took the aircraft down.

When you look at what else the North Vietnamese had during the Vietnam War, you would probably suggest that the most likely option would have been the North Vietnamese army use of an SA2 surface-to-air missile—a Guideline—which the Russians used to call the S57. That sort of rocket was radio controlled. It could go as high as 20 kilometres in the air—more than enough for it cover Canberra bombers—and had a range of 45 kilometres. It was known that within the broader vicinity the North Vietnamese army had deployed SA2s—the S57 Guideline.

There is no doubt that this is a highly effective weapon because this was the weapon that was credited with the shooting down of the U2 plane over Russia in 1960, with Francis Gary Powers being the famous pilot of that. I would imagine that there will be further information coming out in the months ahead, but I believe that with the Magpie 91, with Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver aboard, it will be found that a SA7 surface-to-air missile was responsible for their deaths and shooting down that aircraft.

To conclude, I would say that No. 2 Squadron within the Royal Australian Air Force for the Vietnam War was a highly regarded squadron of very courageous men that served their country very well. With regards to Magpie 91 and Herbert and Carver, they were doing their duty. They had done quite a few missions. They had been very effective in their work as well. They were no doubt very proud and effective members of No. 2 Squadron. As I said right at the start, I am sure the final resolution of this matter will be of some comfort to their long-suffering families. It is most particularly good news that this chapter in Australian history, for our service men and women, is closed—with all Australians recovered that were killed and never found at the time of their death. It is a good time for Australia, with a tinge of sadness, but it is important that we finish the chapter on this part of our military history.

While their deaths were tragic for their families, friends and those that knew them, it was the supreme sacrifice and it was a cause worth fighting for. I know that not long after the end of our involvement in the Vietnam War there was a time when we as nation tended to look back upon how there were mistakes made and that maybe we should not have been there. But I would like to make mention that the government took some decisions at the time which they thought were right.

In any case, despite what has occurred or our assessments since then, there are a lot of Vietnamese people who lived in the south of Vietnam, in the Republic of Vietnam, that absolutely, categorically, supported our involvement in that war and appreciated the sacrifices that were made by our servicemen, in particular by those who lost their lives. So I would say that, despite the politics of it, we can be certain now that this country, as one, greatly appreciates the fact that Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver will be coming home very soon. That will be a great day and we all look forward to it. To their families I would say: they did not die in vain; they served their country very well. They served the causes of freedom and democracy. I hope that the families will rest a little bit easier now.

Alan Griffin (Bruce, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Veterans' Affairs) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I rise today to speak briefly with respect to this motion regarding the location of the remains of the last two members of the Australian Defence Force missing from the Vietnam conflict, Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver, and to express my condolences to their families at their loss. I also express our collective thanks that at this time the mystery that surrounded their deaths has at least partly been resolved and that their remains are able to be repatriated back to Australia to proper and just heroes burials where their families can pay their last respects in an appropriate manner.

Others have spoken regarding the detail of what took place so long ago, so I will not go into great detail, other than to mention that on 3 November 1970 they were believed killed when their Canberra bomber disappeared while flying a night bombing mission in the northern 1 Corps region of South Vietnam. An extensive aerial search of the area failed to find any trace of the aircraft or crew and was called off after three days. It was a particularly inhospitable part of the country and the circumstances around the question of where they may have crashed have been a matter of conjecture for many years.

What we have seen on this occasion, though, is the location and repatriation, so many years after the event, of the last remains of six men who had been MIA in Vietnam and were left behind. In this context, I would particularly like to acknowledge Jim Bourke, Peter Aylett and others from Operation Aussies Home for the work they did. It is true to say—and it is understandable, I guess, in the circumstances—that many within the Defence Force and through official channels had taken the view that so many years after the event, given the circumstances around those particular disappearances, it was going to be too difficult to mount missions to establish the identities and recover the remains of these soldiers and airmen. However, Jim Bourke and those veterans who involved themselves in Operation Aussies Home took the view that in fact it could be done. Working together they were able to effectively lead the charge with respect to official sources in order to ensure that it was recognised that it should be done, and they were given invaluable assistance in ensuring it was done. In saying this, I acknowledge the previous government with respect to assistance given by then Minister Billson in the early stages of this plan, and I know that that was appreciated at the time by people like Jim Bourke.

From talking to Jim, I know they very much approached this in a military manner. They took the view that the circumstances around Private Gillson and Lance Corporal Parker’s deaths meant they were probably the casualties whose location would be most easily established and therefore there was greater capacity for their recovery. So they targeted them and focused on that and were successful. Subsequently, Lance Corporal Gillespie, who came down in a helicopter crash, was located. I had the privilege, on behalf of the government, of accompanying his relatives to Vietnam in December 2007 for the repatriation of his remains. Subsequently Private Fisher was located and then of course were the two gentlemen we are speaking of today.

I think it is important also to acknowledge the ADF, particularly the Army History Unit and the work that they did with respect to a number of these casualties, and, in the most recent situation, the role of Air Force in mounting the mission to bring these boys home. I know that Peter Aylett was part of the most recent mission. He has described to me some of the details around the ruggedness of the location. It was particularly inhospitable country. He told me some stories about the sorts of conditions that they found there which meant that it really was quite an effort to be able to get to the location, identify the remains and bring them back. But that work was done, and it is a credit to those who were involved that it was done.

It brings to an end a chapter of the Vietnam War that has been open and unfinished for many, many years. We now look back at a conflict that was our longest war, some 10 years long, where some 60,000 Australians served across the forces—Army, Navy and Air Force—521 paid the ultimate sacrifice, some 2,400 were wounded in battle and many more returned with scars, both physical and mental.

Others have spoken about the issues around the proper recognition of those who fought in Vietnam and the nature of the public debate that occurred at that time and in the years subsequent. What we can and should say is that those who served their country at that time did it in the very best Anzac tradition. They served where they were required to serve at the orders of the government of the day, and they served their country with great dignity, great pride and great honour.

The families of those six who were left behind, from those that I have met and those that I have heard of, have had many years to ponder, worry and grieve, but always in a situation where there was a certain open question—open wound, if you like—that was still to be resolved. I know from talking to some of them that, in their cases, they feel that that is now something that can be better dealt with. It is not a situation I have ever had to deal with. It is not a situation that I would wish anyone to have to deal with, but I hope that in the circumstances, for the families of Herbert and Carver, we have a similar situation as I think occurred with a number of the relatives of the earlier MIAs, and that is an opportunity for some closure. I certainly believe that, with that, all those involved in ensuring that the last of our boys were brought home can look back and say this was something that was long overdue but which needed to be done.

Stuart Robert (Fadden, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

‘When you go home, tell them of us and say, “For your tomorrow, we gave our today.”‘ That is a simple inscription on a tombstone in Gallipoli. It is reflective of over 100,000 of our country men and women who lie buried on foreign soil, having given their lives in defence of the freedom that we enjoy so passionately today. One of those 100,000 is one of my cousins, Lieutenant Carthew, who died on 7 August 1915 with the 8th Light Horse Regiment, when he led his men to charge at the Nek. I have stood at the Nek, on the Gallipoli Peninsula, as it overlooks the beautiful Anzac Cove—and turning around you can see Suvla Bay—and I have wondered where he lay. He was buried where he fell, with no marked grave, as were many of the 8th Light Horse and the accompanying 10th Light Horse when they charged that fateful day over an area a few tennis courts in width. He was buried where he fell, with no marker, no grave to know of.

I have read his diaries and listened to his mother speak from those pages. She often wondered where her boy lay. She writes that, at the literal minute Lieutenant Carthew died at the Nek, his dog, the family dog, ran away and disappeared. She did not know why until three days later, when the historian CEW Bean wrote of the historic charge of the 8th and 10th Light Horse on that morning of 7 August, and she realised that was the time.

There are so many things we cannot explain in the tragedy of combat and the fiery battle of war. But one thing that can be explained is that wherever possible we must seek to bring our fallen home. Families give their loved ones to fight in the name of freedom, to defend the land they passionately love, with the expectation and the hope that their family will come home but, if they do not, that there will be the opportunity to bring their boy or their daughter home to bury them in the land they love.

In 1987, 22 years ago, I spoke about those missing in Vietnam. I spoke about Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver and I spoke about the soldiers, the infantrymen, who were missing, and the desire that they should come home to be buried in the land they loved. So it is with great pride that we reflect on what Pilot Officer Robert Carver and Flying Officer Michael Herbert have done. Stationed at Phan Rang in South Vietnam, they were sent on a bombing mission over Da Nang on 3 November 1970. At about 2022 hours Carver radioed Magpie Base that he had dropped his bomb load from the Canberra bomber from 7,000 metres. At 2215 hours radio contact was lost with the aircraft, and it subsequently failed to return to base.

With no eyes to witness, there was varied opinion, of course, on their fate. One popular theory is that a Vietcong heat-seeking missile tracked them down and sent the No. 2 Squadron bomber down into the dense jungle. We will never know exactly how that aircraft crashed but we do know that two warriors were lost that night. Search teams tried to locate Carver and Herbert and were clearly unsuccessful. It was never known for sure if they survived the crash, yet with a descent from such altitude into the jungle it was ‘missing in action, presumed dead’.

Flying Officer Michael Herbert was 24 years old when that Canberra bomber was lost. He was the pilot of Magpie 91 and a veteran of 198 operational sorties over Vietnam. He joined the squadron in February 1970 and was from Glenelg in South Australia. Pilot Officer Robert Carver was also just 24 years old. He was the navigator of Magpie 91 and had conducted 33 sorties in Vietnam. He joined in September 1970 and was from Toowoomba in Queensland. This morning in this House I pass on the condolences of the member for Groom, who represents Toowoomba, the Hon. Ian Macfarlane. He is away, unfortunately, and unable to speak in the House today. But he would want me to speak fondly of these two men, including Pilot Officer Carver from Toowoomba who, at such a young age, went to fight for our freedom’s name.

Greg Combet, the Minister for Defence Personnel, Materiel and Science, says that their remains were found in an extremely remote area of Vietnam near the Laotian border. It is a testimony to the work done by the previous government and, indeed, this government, and I also acknowledge Operation Aussies Home—particularly Jim Bourke—for their resolute determination to ensure our warriors come home.

The very first bomber to go down in the Korean War was piloted by Squadron Leader Graham Strout, my mother’s cousin. The opportunity to recover Squadron Leader Strout’s body and to see the wreckage brought great comfort to my family. I can only imagine the difficulty for the families of Pilot Officer Carver and Flying Officer Michael Herbert in not knowing for so many years. Now, 39 years later, we can bring two warriors home and we can bury them with the honours that befit them.

It will only ever be a small gesture by a nation, but it is a gesture that stands up tall and says thank you: ‘Thank you for your service that came before self. Thank you for your sacrifice that came before comfort. Thank you for your endurance in the face of an enemy that came before your personal freedom.’ We owe our service men and women and, indeed, our veterans a great debt of gratitude that in many ways we will never be able to repay. But we can stand in this place at this time and on behalf of a very grateful nation we can say thank you. We can proudly say, ‘We did not leave our fallen soldiers and airmen; we sought to recover them.’ Even though it may have taken 39 long years, we this year bring home the last two of our fallen warriors, as a nation should do for its heroes.

Tony Zappia (Makin, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I too rise to speak on this motion. On Sunday, 16 August I attended at the Torrens Parade Ground in Adelaide, as I have for several years now, a commemorative service for the Australians who served in Vietnam and, in particular, in remembrance of the 521 Australians who died as a result of serving our country there. Last week the Prime Minister advised that the remains of Pilot Officer Robert Carver and Flying Officer Michael Herbert, who had been missing in Vietnam since the war, had finally been found and were being returned to Australia. I extend my condolences and respects to the families, friends and colleagues of Pilot Officer Robert Carver and Flying Officer Michael Herbert. For their families, their return will bring a sense of closure. It will also bring them some peace of mind by having better knowledge of the fate of these two servicemen and finally bringing to an end 39 years of uncertainty. The return of the two servicemen is also significant to Australia as a nation because it marks the end of unfinished business relating to the Vietnam War.

I did not personally know Pilot Officer Robert Carver, who I understand came from Queensland, or Flying Officer Michael Herbert, who was from my home state of South Australia and lived at Glenelg. However, over the years I have listened to and spoken with many associates and friends who did serve in Vietnam. I have heard their stories, I have seen their photos and I have read their accounts of the Vietnam War. Every war is horrific, and Vietnam was no exception. But for Australians who served in Vietnam it was different from other wars because of the deep divisions throughout the country on Australia’s involvement in that war. Understandably, many of those Australians who served felt their service was never properly recognised. That has added to the tragedy and to the memories and psychological scars that many who served there still carry. I am encouraged, however, that as each year passes greater recognition is being given to the Australians who served in Vietnam. Hundreds of Vietnam veterans and their family members attended Sunday’s march and wreath-laying ceremony in Adelaide and then stayed on for a day of family entertainment. It was particularly meaningful to be joined at the memorial service by ex-South Vietnamese defence force members who proudly wore their own uniforms and medals.

In addition to attending the services on Sunday the 16th, I was represented yesterday, 18 August, by James Piekert from my office at the annual Long Tan Day service at Montague Farm in my electorate. Being in Canberra I was unable to attend the Montague Farm ceremony, but it is of special significance to me. Montague Farm is an estate name for a relatively new community of some 1,300 homes, in the suburb of Pooraka within the city of Salisbury, that was developed by the South Australian Housing Trust around 20 years ago. The estate has become an important monument to Vietnam War veterans for three reasons. Firstly, a formal monument has been constructed in Henderson Square in recognition of the Vietnam War veterans. Secondly, each year a Long Tan Day and wreath-laying ceremony is held at the memorial site, and I understand it has become one of the largest Long Tan Day ceremonies in Australia. Thirdly, on the initiative of Fred Pritchard, a Vietnam veteran himself and the project manager for the South Australian Housing Trust at the time, all roads within Montague Farm have been named after South Australian soldiers who lost their lives in Vietnam. There is Noack Street, in recognition of the first national serviceman to lose his life in Vietnam, Private Errol Noack, who died on 24 May 1966, only 16 days after he said goodbye to his family. Henderson Street and Henderson Square, where the memorial is located, are named in memory of Warrant Officer Malcolm Henderson, who died on 16 December 1967. Badcoe Street is named after Major Peter Badcoe VC, who lost his life on 7 April 1967 and was posthumously awarded the Victoria Cross. I could go on with every other street name but clearly time is limited today.

To emphasise the initiative and significance begun by Fred Pritchard, Salisbury City Council designed and installed special street signs which note the rank and date of the death of the soldier after whom the street is named. These signs and the names on them will become permanent memorials to many of the South Australian soldiers who lost their lives in Vietnam.

I should mention that the northern branch of the Vietnam Veterans Association this year walked from Port Augusta to Adelaide, raising funds for Legacy, the Vietnam Veterans Scholarship Foundation and the Repatriation General Hospital in Adelaide. I understand that they raised around $25,000 as a result of their long walk. This is the third occasion since 2005 that they have made the walk. The first walk was also from Port Augusta to Adelaide and, on the second occasion, they walked from Renmark to Adelaide. This year they were joined on the walk by the only surviving Vietnam Victoria Cross recipient, Keith Payne VC, who again came down from Queensland to support his mates. Four Victoria Crosses were awarded to Australian defence personnel who served in the Vietnam War. They were Keith Payne, whom I have just mentioned, and Major Peter Badcoe, whom I mentioned earlier. There is also Kevin Wheatley, who was killed in action on 13 November 1965, and Warrant Officer Ray Simpson, who was awarded a VC for his actions on 6 and 11 May 1969.

Along the way from Port Augusta to Adelaide, Keith Payne and Ian Leraye, a long-time friend of mine from Salisbury, stopped at schools in Port Augusta, Stirling, Quorn, Wilmington, Booleroo Centre, Gladstone, Port Pirie, Clare and Kapunda, where they addressed schoolchildren about the Vietnam War. It is so important that children of today are aware of what earlier generations went through in going to war. What better way for these children to learn about this than through hearing the stories in person from those who were there?

Wherever the men and women of our defence forces are serving in the world, they are fighting for and on behalf of Australia. As such, it is vital that the Australian government do everything in its power to ensure that those who lose their lives serving overseas are either brought home or have their memory appropriately preserved in foreign graves. Whether it was at Gallipoli, Fromelles, in northern France, or Vietnam, Australians who have died serving their country abroad must have their memory recognised and honoured.

Over the years, Australia as a nation has taken many significant steps to ensure that veterans of the Vietnam War receive the respect and acknowledgment that they did not initially receive on their return to Australia. The 1987 Welcome Home March, when 25,000 veterans of the Vietnam War came from all over Australia to march through Sydney, gave many veterans the public support and demonstration of gratitude that veterans from earlier wars had received on their immediate return home. The 1996 pilgrimage to Vietnam of 30 Australian veterans, representing all elements who served in Vietnam, visited Saigon, Nui Dat, Vung Tau and Long Tan in a symbolic gesture of ‘laying the ghosts’.

Many Australian service personnel have since returned to Vietnam of their own volition and engaged in community work there, such as the construction of a new school in Long Tan. There have also been significant occasions such as the 2002 rededication of the Australian Vietnam Forces National Memorial and the 40th anniversary of the Battle of Long Tan commemoration in 2006, where Vietnam veterans have been appropriately recognised and honoured. I believe that the discovery and return to Australia of the remains of Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver will be another significant occasion in the history of Australia and its commemoration of the Vietnam War. The last remains of Australian servicemen missing in Vietnam are being returned home.

I too commend the work of the Air Force investigation team; the Defence Science and Technology Organisation, whose innovative modelling techniques were used in locating the crash site; and the Army History Unit, whose exhaustive research and expertise supported the investigations. I also acknowledge the assistance provided by the local villagers, Vietnamese authorities and former North Vietnamese and Vietcong soldiers and commanders. I hope that the discovery of their remains brings some closure and peace to the families of Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver, as well as to their mates in the broader Vietnam veterans community.

I close with the prayer that was given by Pastor David Marr at the service that I attended on Sunday morning, because I believe that it sums up our view about those men and women who served this country:

Father, as we look to the past we give thanks for all those who fought for peace and were prepared to sacrifice their lives for the safety of their loved ones and friends.

We remember with gratitude those who gave their lives for the cause of peace, dying that we might live in a just and free world.

We pray for those who suffer still living with the tortured memories of loved ones and mates lost, suffering physical and mental pain from a past that still holds its terrors. Not all wounds are visible.

We pray that we will learn the lessons of the past so that the future will be a time of peace, a future where reconciliation will be found in words and not acts of hatred; and a future where there will be recognition that we are brothers and sisters tied together by our humanity.

Let us in our own lives, by our words and by our actions, live lives in peace and in love towards our neighbours and may the nations of the world be inspired to work together for the common good of all humanity.

Dennis Jensen (Tangney, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Five hundred and twenty-one Australians were killed in action in Vietnam. The problem with looking at statistics is that statistics are just statistics; they do not tell any personal stories and they do not give the feeling of the tragedy involved in each of those cases. Today I am speaking about just two of those people who were killed in Vietnam: Flying Officer Michael Herbert, who was 24, of Glenelg in South Australia, and Pilot Officer Robert Carver, also 24, from Toowoomba. Pilot Officer Carver was the navigator-bombardier and Flying Officer Herbert was the pilot and aircraft commander. They were both in No. 2 Squadron RAAF and they were flying in the I Corps region in South Vietnam, conducting a bombing raid approximately 60 kilometres from Da Nang. This occurred on 3 November 1970.

About 30 years ago I crawled through a Canberra bomber. I can tell you it is an incredibly cramped aircraft. It is very old-fashioned, particularly in today’s terms. The bombers first flew 60 years ago. It required incredible discipline to fly these aircraft, particularly at night. Just picture the story of these two men and numerous others who were flying these missions day in, day out. Picture them sitting in the briefing room with knotted stomachs, with an ever-present fear of the mission—but not a fear that meant that they were not going to conduct their mission. They knew what they were doing. They were highly disciplined. They were doing a job. They worked with that fear but that fear was ever present.

Picture them taking off at night. People who have flown over Australia, and particularly to Western Australia, can imagine just how dark it would have been over jungle type regions with very little habitation and very few electric lights. They flew at 22,000 feet in the pitch black. Occasionally they would see what is referred to as AAA, anti-aircraft artillery. They would see tracers coming up or explosions of flak. At 22,000 feet you are above most of that; nevertheless, you see these shells and bullets trying to get towards you. You fly for an hour and 22 minutes and you try to find your target. You then find it and you bomb it. In this case, the bombs were dropped at 8.22. Shortly after that, the aircraft disappeared from radar.

As I said, 22,000 feet was higher than most of the AAA. There were no known SA2s or SAM2s, which were very large radar-guided missiles, in the area; however, they could still have been there. I am reminded of the late General Robin Olds talking about, as he called it, the ‘terribly impersonal personal nature’ of having a surface-to-air missile fired at you. This missile is inanimate, yet it is coming, as he said, to get you. I can only imagine what must have run through these men’s minds through the mission. No-one really knows why that aircraft was lost. As I said, there have been theories such as a heat-seeking missile; however, I am not aware of a heat-seeking surface-to-air missile at the time that had that sort of range. Another theory was that perhaps one of the bombs hung up, so to speak, within the aircraft when they conducted their bombing mission and that it exploded a little bit later. But, as I said, no-one will really know what the reason for that crash was.

But I do know that Australia owes those who have died in our service a great debt of gratitude, and I can only imagine the emotions that must be going through the minds of the men’s families as they now have closure and realise exactly what happened to their loved ones. At least now they have that certainty, which they did not have before. But this is also something that we really need to consider for the future. This is why I will continue to push very hard for proper evaluation processes for our defence capabilities to ensure that our defence men and women have the very best equipment that they possibly can. We have to remember that these men and women are going and fighting—abroad, generally, in the Australian context, and extremely rarely defending Australia directly. There is great potential for them to perish in combat, and we have to do everything that we possibly can to reduce the numbers of those killed and also the numbers of those who are wounded and the severity of their wounds. So we need to ensure that we have adequate capability—in fact, the best capability that we can possibly get—for our fighting men and women, and we also need to ensure that the acquisition processes that are followed are better defined than they are at present so that we get those capabilities to our men and women as quickly as possible and do not have the protracted delays and problems that we currently have.

Having said that, this is a condolence motion for Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver. I would like to suggest to Australians that, when they think about our losses in combat, they remember that these people are not mere statistics; these are people who have died in Australia’s service. Every story is personal and, where people are killed, every story is tragic.

Rowan Ramsey (Grey, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I rise today on this condolence motion for the last two members of the Australian Defence Force missing from the Vietnam conflict. On 3 November 1970, Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver of No. 2 Squadron RAAF, on a mission in a Canberra bomber, were reported missing in action. ‘Missing in action’ is a terrible term. It is an incomplete story, and one of the most difficult stories for the families to deal with. I congratulate those on the Air Force investigation team who have now recovered the full six missing-in-actions from the Vietnam War and thank the Vietnamese government and people for their assistance.

Michael Herbert was from Glenelg in South Australia and a veteran of 198 sorties. I have learnt quite recently that Michael’s father, John, came from Port Pirie, in my electorate, and that his uncles, aunties and cousins still reside there. I can tell you that the 40 years since his disappearance have been very difficult for them and that they have struggled to deal with the nature of their loss. They are relieved that he has been located and brought back to Australia.

Robert Carver, the navigator, was from Toowoomba and was a relative novice who had been in Vietnam for just eight weeks. Both were 24 years old and had started on that great journey of life. Both, it is worth reflecting, would now be 63. I am always quite moved by the RSL ode when I hear the line: ‘They shall not grow old, as we that are left grow old.’ It causes me to reflect on not only those that we have lost in war but also the number of friends that I have lost. When I travel around my electorate and visit people and I am invited into their living rooms I will often see a photo of a young soldier on a mantelpiece—it may be from any of the conflicts—that is still there 40, 60, 80 years on because that is someone they lost. The young face stares back at you and the very old face which belongs to their brother or sister will be alongside it. I reflect on that, because we grow old but they never shall.

We may never know what happened on 3 November 1970, but we do know about these men’s courage and commitment to Australia. The recovery of their remains is of great solace to their families and I thank them for the greatest contribution of all that they can make to this nation. Today, the recovery of these remains is more—much more. It is a symbol of the closing of a chapter in the book. It is not the last chapter in the book because the last chapters of the book of the Vietnam conflict will not be written until the last survivors and the last people who have collective memory of that war have passed away, but we are nearing the end of the book. The Vietnam War for Australia went from 1962 to 1972—10 years. In Vietnam, interestingly enough, it is called the American war. It is all about perspective. I guess it just depends on where you are sitting and the way you look at the world.

For Australia, there were 60,000 personnel involved, 2,500 wounded, 521 dead and thousands with their lives changed forever by the conflict. Australia, on one hand, had a very proud record. We were very proud of our servicemen; the way they conducted themselves operationally and the respect in which they are held to this day in Vietnam. On the other hand, it involved a shameful event in Australia’s history: shame on this nation for how we treated our servicemen when the war became unpopular. There is no point now arguing about the rights and wrongs of the war—largely seen as a useless war—but there is the old question: if a butterfly flaps its wings on one side of the earth, does it a cause a cyclone on the other? If the Vietnam War had not occurred, would the whole world be different now? We will never know. But we do know that Australia will never again allow people to attack our armed forces for the decisions of government. Rightfully they should attack governments, but they should never, ever target the workmen.

The Vietnam War is very real to me. It was the first time that conscripts had been sent to a theatre of war. In 1972, I was 16. My friends and I, nearing our last years of school, had expected that we would go into the draft and that some of us would serve. Had our marble been drawn, we almost certainly would have all gone. So this was a very real thing in our lives. For the first time in our living rooms, on television, we were looking at action shots of the war as it was happening and action shots of the protest movement as it was evolving around Australia. It is an interesting thing, as I reflect on my youth and my time at school, talking with my friends as we spoke of the Second World War, in the mid-60s it all seemed so long ago. It was something that happened a million years ago, if you like. You failed, as a child, to understand how people could still be offended by what happened so long ago. In reality, it was only 15 or 20 years.

When you now look at the Vietnam War you can see that personal contact is what keeps the memories alive. As long as people have personal contact with these events, the memories will remain fresh. Those born after the Vietnam War probably look at it as just another conflict, but for those of us who lived through that era it will always be something very real. I had the pleasure a few years ago of visiting Vietnam with my family. We explored some of the sites where Australian troops had been represented and the war museums. When I saw the famous photos from the press corps that I had seen 35 years ago in our newspapers it brought back to me what a very real part of my life it was.

I congratulate the Vietnam veterans associations around Australia on the excellent job they do in helping the veterans of that conflict overcome the pain, and resettle and remake their lives. The recognition of the Vietnam conflict with Vietnam Veterans Day on 18 August, a date that represents the Long Tan battle, has been a great move forward in the healing with the rest of Australia. This year on Anzac Day I launched the Bruce Plane Memorial Medal at Yorketown. It was for the best player of the rematch of last year’s grand final in the Yorke Peninsula Football League. Bruce Plane was a soldier from Price who died in Vietnam. Although it has taken 40 years for this recognition to occur, it is very important this war has moved into mainstream Australia now and is not considered a boutique war. It was a very real confrontation; a very real war.

At this time when the families of Michael Herbert and Robert Carver are settling the last unknowns they can have some closure in their lives. I hope this brings peace to them. For the population as a whole it is a time to remember all who have put their lives on the line for Australia’s interests, including those who are serving in international theatres of conflict as we speak and the families of the 10 servicemen who have given their lives in the line of duty in Afghanistan. This is especially a time to remember those who made the ultimate sacrifices in Vietnam. On behalf of a grateful nation, I say to their families, thank you.

Bruce Scott (Maranoa, National Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

On indulgence, I want to make a very important contribution to the condolence motion that recognises the return of our two final missing from Vietnam. What a moment it is for all Australians to know that the last two, who had been missing for so long, will be finally coming home to Australia. It is now more than 39 years since they went missing in action. The bodies of Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver have been found. As a nation we all waited with anticipation for the day these remains would be found.

The Air Force recovery teams, the Vietnamese officials and all involved knew that we would never give up the search for the missing—whether in Vietnam or other theatres of war—and trying to identify those buried as unknown Australian soldiers or airmen. We will continue to work to identify and to find the remains of the missing. Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver will now not be on the Vietnam veterans’ memorial on Anzac Parade as missing, but will be with all of those now who have been recovered and returned to Australia.

It was on 3 November 1970 that the two servicemen, who were members of the 2nd Squadron Royal Australian Air Force, were participating in a night-time bombing mission. They were returning after that mission to their base when they disappeared in the Quang Nam province near the Laotian border. The day after they disappeared from the radar screen an extensive aerial search of the area was undertaken by both Australian and American units. After three days the search was called off. The search was hampered by bad weather conditions and was made extremely difficult by the very rugged expanse where they were reported missing.

Pilot Officer Carver had served in Vietnam for just eight weeks and Flying Officer Herbert had just two months to go before he would finish his tour of duty and return to Australia. Both were 24 years of age. I guess it is hard for us in this generation and in this time but often I pause at a war memorial in my electorate and just listen all around me to the silence, the peace and the wonderful life that I have enjoyed and reflect on the loss of so many Australians throughout time to give us this peace in this wonderful Australia. I think of when I was 24, thinking about marriage and thinking about a business, and I think about these two officers—just 24 years of age—and look now in 2009 at what they lost in their lives. I guess it is hard to really understand the pain felt by their families and, indeed, the families of all soldiers who have been lost in action. I know that over the ensuring decade Joan Herbert, who was Michael’s mother—whose son was only two months short of returning home—wrote some 600 letters to the Vietnamese authorities hoping that perhaps those letters might identify where her son was. I am sure that, as a mother, she never really gave up hope not only that her son would be found but that he would be found alive.

I was the Minister for Veterans’ Affairs in 1996 when I took the very first official pilgrimage back to Vietnam: veterans, war widows, next of kin and a number of servicemen representing the units which had served there. I have to say they were a great bunch of people. For them, it was going to be a return to some areas that had troubled them since their return from Vietnam. We had the widow of Peter Badcoe VC—and what a wonderful woman she is—and she was representing in so many ways the widows. We had the next of kin represented by a wonderful young lady who was starting to grow up at 20-odd years of age but who was four when she lost her father—a father she never knew. To take them back to Saigon, and to talk to them, helped me as the Minister for Veterans’ Affairs. It gave me a personal insight into not only how they felt about their service, how they had in so many ways got on with life since returning, but also the sense of camaraderie between the Vietnam veterans and what it meant to be a widow, a next of kin or a Vietnam veteran themselves. I will never forget the then Deputy Prime Minister, and a Vietnam veteran himself, Tim Fischer, joining us at Nui Dat. We had a very small memorial service at Nui Dat and he was able also to bring a sense of how he had got on with life and was able to manage in some ways in his own life the trauma that war can so often bring to people.

I was also able to see the work that the Vietnam Veterans Reconstruction Team are doing in Vietnam. I think in some ways that is also a measure of the Australian task force in Vietnam. I will never forget driving around some of the villages and areas around Vung Tau, Nui Dat and Ba Ria. We saw a Southern Cross windmill, made in Toowoomba—the home, of course, of Flying Officer Carver, who never returned having died that night in his Canberra bomber. In so many ways our reconstruction team was there helping these villages—for example by bringing clean, fresh, running water to their communities. That work goes on today with the Vietnam Veterans Reconstruction Team, and I commend them for the work that they do. It is important that we as a nation recognise that there was enormous damage inflicted on those communities and on so many innocent people. I know that the Vietnam veterans themselves, through the reconstruction team and the corporate support that they receive, are well meaning and are certainly making a difference to many of those communities which were formerly the battlefields of the Vietnam War.

I also want to say something about the new Vietnam gallery at the Australian War Memorial. It is a great credit to the board of the Australian War Memorial and all those who put the concept together. There is an Iroquois helicopter there, simulating a dust-off. There is a theatrette, where the battle of Long Tan is reconstructed and there are talks about the losses incurred. In many ways it is about the triumph of the Australian soldier under such trying conditions. In fact, when we stood in the battlefields of Long Tan we had with us Jim Richmond, who was left for dead that night but was actually recovered the following day. He also features in A Letter from Home in the theatrette in the galleries of the Australian War Memorial. I just want to say to those who may be listening today that if they are ever in Canberra I would commend not only a visit to the Australian War Memorial but a visit to the new galleries that they have completed, including the Vietnam gallery, which I think does great credit to all those who served in Vietnam. It is appropriate; it has been appropriately done. I think the people, including young children, who visit that very important and poignant gallery will gain not only an understanding of the sacrifices made throughout wars but a knowledge of our involvement in the Vietnam War.

We can now close the book on these six brave servicemen who were missing in action. Finally we know the identification and final location of Flying Officer Michael Herbert and Pilot Officer Robert Carver, and they are coming home. In conclusion, I just want to say to all of us in Australia who have inherited the great legacy of freedom and the wonderful democracy we have that they come at a great price and we should never forget the sacrifices made nor the families who continue to suffer silently today. I am reminded once again of Joan Herbert, Michael’s mother, who kept writing and writing and writing, never giving up hope. I know we have families experiencing this today, and I saw it personally as veterans’ affairs minister. They never give up hope, thinking that one day their loved one will be found or their remains identified in a grave somewhere in the world, where they are listed as an Australian soldier or airman but nothing more than that. I commend all those who have been involved in the recovery. The work was never stopped. I want to also thank the Vietnamese authorities for their cooperation in helping this nation finally find the last two of our missing in Vietnam.