Stephen Bates (Brisbane, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The NDIS is so difficult to navigate, especially at the appeals and review stages—so difficult, in fact, that there are dedicated community advocacy groups that have been set up to assist. Because these groups are so underfunded and the demand is so high, many people with disability and their families are being left alone to navigate this complex bureaucracy. They're essentially having to beg for choice and control and for their medical evidence to be taken into account. It is exhausting for individuals with disability and their carers and relatives, who are already dealing with the challenges of daily life with disability. In so many instances, the NDIS is providing no updates to my constituents and no accountability for the turnaround time, especially in change-of-circumstance applications. My team should not have to ring up the minister's office or MASCO because a case has dragged on for so long that it has become an urgent and imminent welfare threat.

This bill, the National Disability Insurance Scheme Amendment (Getting the NDIS Back on Track No. 1) Bill 2024, proposes the most significant changes to the NDIS since it started more than a decade ago. Understandably, the disability community and NDIS participants, along with families, carers and NDIS workers, are concerned about the changes being proposed. Let's discuss this bill in the context of Labor's latest budget—a budget where the government has chosen to prioritise giving handouts to fossil fuel companies, weapons manufacturers and countless other megacorporations, and, at the same time, has chosen to gut money from NDIS participants to the tune of $14.4 billion. We have a government carrying on about the budget surplus while slashing funds from Australians with disability. It is absolutely shameful.

This bill is Labor's thinly-veiled foundation for future NDIS cuts. The NDIS is already struggling, with my constituents genuinely fearful of how much worse waiting times can get and funding cuts will blow out. This bill was created behind closed doors, with representatives of the disability community forced to sign nondisclosure agreements. The government is so concerned about its terrible plans for the NDIS becoming public that it made people, under fear of prosecution, sign nondisclosure agreements. How is this genuine co-design?

This bill intends to transition every NDIS participant from an old framework plan to a new framework plan over the next five years. The supports that are working so well for people, whether that's support to be active community members, go to work, help in their homes—so much more would be put back in the hands of agency staff. Essentially, this means each and every NDIS participant's future on the scheme is in question. This bill will make it easier for bureaucrats to prevent people from accessing the NDIS. It will also make it easier for bureaucrats to remove people from the scheme entirely. This bill is set to prescribe specifics of what you can and can't get from the NDIS, which is in and of itself an incredibly significant change from the original intention of the NDIS.

The NDIS is supposed to be a scheme that enables each individual disabled person to achieve their goals. But here we have Labor trying to return us to the days of disabled people's lives being dictated by out-of-touch politicians. This bill will see a restriction of support available through the scheme. It will limit the ability to have NDIS plans that are based on individual needs, and it will replace 'reasonable and necessary' with a new single definition of 'NDIS supports'—supports that meet a narrow, new definition.

This bill attempts to set up a way of pushing people off the NDIS into supports it suggests will be provided by states and territories. The reality, however, is there is no possible way the states and territories can provide those supports in time, especially not in a way that is nationally consistent and that will guarantee no disabled person becomes worse off under Labor's NDIS plan. Removing people from the scheme to services that don't yet exist is outrageously poor planning with obviously harmful consequences.

One of the most concerning aspects of this bill is the precedent it sets for future cuts and changes. This bill will enable the agency to make significant changes to the scheme in the future without community consultation. The Greens acknowledge the second reading amendment from Mr Sukkar and support the call to release the modelling that underpins the NDIS Financial Sustainability Framework and to provide a detailed outline of the inevitable cuts participants should expect as a result of these changes. I, along with my colleagues in the Senate, have been calling on the government to release this framework for matter of months, but the Labor government has been unwilling to provide transparency to this parliament or to the Australian people.

Despite the Greens' support for the release of these documents, we are not able to support the overall amendment. The Greens will actively participate in the inquiry into this bill and we will be bringing forward significant amendments to this legislation. But, as the bill stands, the Greens will not support Labor choosing to cut support to disabled people.

Meryl Swanson (Paterson, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The National Disability Insurance Scheme is something that as a member of the Labor government I am particularly proud of. It's interesting to note that this concept of an insurance scheme for people with disability in our country was first mooted in the 1970s when Gough Whitlam was Prime Minister. But, like all prime ministers, he had to make choices and he decided that he would put his efforts at that time into Medibank and then what we now know as Medicare. It was actually modelled on a system from New Zealand. Decades later, an independent submission was made to the government by a group called the Disability Investment Group. That reported on the state of disability support in Australia. It deemed that disability was being treated as an economic issue and not a social one and people with disability were seen merely as numbers pumped into a spreadsheet. It was really a substandard way for anyone, quite frankly, to be treated in a modern, liberal, wealthy democracy.

We know that, thanks to the work of our predecessors, Medicare has been, on balance, a huge success in our country when we step back and take a look at the health care broadly of our nation. Like with any big system there are always improvements to be made. But we know that, if you are in dire need of medical help, you can go to a hospital and receive the assistance that you need and you don't need to be able to pay for it. You can rely on your Medicare card. That is a good thing.

The original concept for the NDIS was a similar idea in that it would be not just another government program but a seismic shift in the way Australians with a disability live in our country. It wasn't just about supports and services. I remember this so clearly having worked in radio at the time when all of this was being discussed very broadly and very passionately across the community. I remember interviewing people and taking many, many calls on talkback radio about this. The premise of this was that, for the first time in the history of our modern nation, people with disabilities would be given choice and control over their lives and the government would have a sophisticated system of offering that choice and control. I still get goosebumps describing that because I remember thinking, 'This is a seminal moment in the history of our nation.'

I was particularly interested at that time in listening to the now minister who is responsible for it, Bill Shorten, and the then member for Jagajaga, Jenny Macklin, talking about this and saying how important it was and what a difference it would make to our country. It took the efforts of former prime minister Julia Gillard to make this a reality. Labor gave birth to this incredible baby that was the NDIS; however, sadly, we weren't in a position to care for it in its early years. Another government came along and made choices about that system. I think some of those choices weren't the best choices. However, the NDIS did prevail.

Now we have found ourselves a number of years—over a decade—down the track, and we are now looking at a system that has made incredible changes to people's lives. Again, with all large-scale government changes, platforms and seismic shifts in the nation, there's often work that needs to be done after it's been in operation for a number of years. We have seen that there have been disappointments with the NDIS—absolutely categorically. I think anyone who was being honest about that would say that that is true. However, the benefit, on balance, far outweighs the difficulties.

Notwithstanding that, this system does need to have an eye to the future. It needs to be able to be sustainable so that we can continue to provide that all-important insurance for people with disabilities to have choice and control over their lives. In listening to the minister today I felt really interested in and very supportive of the notion that we are providing more funding. He described it as a 'fraud fusion team' who are really looking to make sure there is not fraudulent behaviour in the NDIS. I think that's incredibly important. You do hear stories of outlandish behaviour and people charging princely sums for supports, and that, quite frankly, is not on. I am again proud to be part of a government that is calling this out and not only doing so but also putting in place the laws and the detection systems to say: 'No. We're not having fraud in this system. We're going to have a well-run, well-organised, self-sustaining NDIS.' That's really the nub of the entire issue. It is about continuing on with this seismic shift in Australian life for people with disabilities.

Whilst I in absolutely no way can really understand what it would be like to have a life with a disability, I have had an injury in recent months which forced me to be in a wheelchair for some time and then on an e-scooter. Let me say that even just that tiny glimpse into not being able to potentially move around as freely opened my eyes and, more importantly, my heart and my head about people with disabilities in Australia and moving around, the supports and the ease of life. It is difficult. Therefore, the more choice and control we can give to people, the more sophisticated we can make the system, the more robust we can make the system, the better. That's why I do think it is important that we look very seriously at this legislation that is now being put forward.

One of the things that I think is very interesting about this is the concept that every participant is able to live an independent life, fully embraced also by their community, and a scheme that is centred around the individual, unlike previous schemes in the past where people were either treated poorly or just cast aside. This scheme is certainly not like that. The other concept that I think is very important is providing early intervention and lifelong support. That's the difference in the new and modern NDIS.

Some of the kinds of disabilities that impact participants, including autism spectrum disorder, multiple sclerosis, spinal cord injuries and cerebral palsy, are incredibly challenging, but people who live and participate very actively in our communities have a right to do so and have a right to be afforded that choice and control. It is a lifelong journey for them, and every day poses new challenges. However, with the support of the NDIS, many of these challenges can be replaced with opportunities. I think that's something that we need to really think about as well in relation to people with disability. It's not just about centring their lives on that disability; it's actually about the contribution that their lives make and the thoughts and dreams and aspirations that they have for their lives and the contribution that that makes to our country as a whole. I think that's a very valuable one and often one that really can't be put into dollars and cents, but I'm very proud to say that we're part of a government who recognises those people as people who are complete and make a very wonderful contribution to our society.

In my electorate of Paterson, there are 7,352 NDIS participants who receive support from the NDIS. My office works diligently with many people. We have a number of stories of people who have contacted our office, and we have a good number of wonderful success stories as well.

I just want to say that I am in support completely of the NDIS. I am in support of making it a robust and lengthy institution in this nation. It does need to be well funded. It does need to be closely and properly scrutinised. The departments that are responsible for it do need to have enough staff to do that properly, and I really do look forward to it lasting for many decades to come and being the absolute choice and control vehicle for many people in Australian society, none more so than the people of Patterson.

Debate interrupted.