Mary Fisher (SA, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I move:

That:

(a)

when the Education, Employment and Workplace Relations Legislation Committee meets to consider additional estimates in 2010:

(i)

the committee further examine Fair Work Australia, and

(ii)

the President of Fair Work Australia appear before the committee to answer questions; and

(b)

on each subsequent occasion on which the Education, Employment and Workplace Relations Legislation Committee meets to consider estimates in relation to Fair Work Australia, the President of Fair Work Australia appear before the committee to answer questions.

I seek leave to make a short statement.

Alan Ferguson (SA, Deputy-President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Do you want to make a short statement before Senator Siewert speaks?

Mary Fisher (SA, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I will make it after.

Rachel Siewert (WA, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I seek leave to amend general business notice of motion No. 596 by removing paragraph (b) so that the motion merely deals with the next sitting of the Senate in 2010 and just paragraph (a) is left in the motion.

Leave granted.

I move by way of amendment:

Omit paragraph (b).

Question negatived.

Mary Fisher (SA, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr Deputy President, I seek leave to make a short statement.

Alan Ferguson (SA, Deputy-President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Leave is granted for two minutes.

Mary Fisher (SA, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

To the extent that there are any arguments agin this motion proceeding, there are essentially two: firstly, that it is somehow a departure from past practice for the president of a national industrial tribunal to appear before this Senate estimates committee; and, secondly, that somehow a president of the national industrial tribunal enjoys judicial status that would somehow be violated by his or her attendance before estimates.

As to the first argument, past practice is irrelevant to the present day. Past practice is irrelevant for two reasons: it does not bind this committee nor does it bind this Senate. This Senate has not decided to never call a public officer of the nature of the president of the national industrial tribunal. The past is also irrelevant, for two reasons of substance. Firstly, these are estimates under the Fair Work Act. The Fair Work Act commenced operation in July this year. It is new legislation. Secondly, the new legislation for the first time expressly gives the President of Fair Work Australia responsibility for the administration of Fair Work Australia.

As to the argument that there is somehow judicial status: yes, the current President of Fair Work Australia happens to be a ‘chapter 3’ judge of the Federal Court. But he does not wear that hat in his capacity as President of Fair Work Australia; nor can he, because Fair Work Australia ain’t a ‘chapter 3’ court. It is a statutory body exercising arbitral powers, not judicial powers. The closest analogy is the President of the Human Rights Commission. She is also titled ‘Justice’ and also happens to be a judge—not as President of the Human Rights Commission—but she attends estimates. The President of Fair Work Australia should get over it, get on with it and get his butt in front of Senate estimates.

Bob Brown (Tasmania, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr Deputy President, I seek leave to make a short statement.

Alan Ferguson (SA, Deputy-President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Leave is granted for two minutes.

Bob Brown (Tasmania, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Siewert moved to remove part (b) of this motion, which would have meant that, on every subsequent occasion when the Senate Education, Employment and Workplace Relations Legislation Committee met, the president would have to appear. We think that that could not be supported. The Greens support the president being required to appear at the additional estimates in 2010, and we suggest that the opposition comes back with that amendment. I note that the opposition has not supported the Governor of the Reserve Bank being brought before the Senate for certain matters to be discussed and that there is an inconsistency there. That aside, we think it is prescriptive to lay down that on every occasion this committee meets to consider estimates the president should appear. We think we can be much more judicious and we would support the opposition coming back with the alternative motion—just part (a).

Gavin Marshall (Victoria, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr Deputy President, I seek leave to make a short statement.

Alan Ferguson (SA, Deputy-President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Leave is granted for two minutes.

Gavin Marshall (Victoria, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

This motion is entirely unnecessary and is merely a political stunt designed to unfairly and improperly embarrass the President of Fair Work Australia. This tactic is straight out of the Liberal Party’s new media play book—

George Brandis (Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Attorney-General) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Why? By making him accountable to parliament, you fool!

Alan Ferguson (SA, Deputy-President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order! Senator Brandis, you will stand and withdraw that comment.

George Brandis (Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Attorney-General) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I withdraw.

Gavin Marshall (Victoria, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Poor George. This tactic is straight out of the Liberal Party’s new media play book: ‘Seek cheap points by smearing public officials.’ There is no controversy that the Senate Education, Employment and Workplace Relations Legislation Committee has the power to compel the attendance of the President of Fair Work Australia, should the committee decided that this was appropriate. The committee actively turned its mind to whether the president should be required to attend the recent hearings. Let us be very clear: the committee did not require the president to attend. Instead, it accepted the president’s most reasonable submission that the general manager, Mr Lee, would be a more appropriate witnesses, as he would be of more assistance to the committee in answering questions about the administrative activities of Fair Work Australia.

The committee confirmed this again this morning when it met and passed the following resolutions. The committee noted that the justice has not refused to appear before the committee. The committee noted that the head of the national industrial tribunal has never been asked to appear at estimates and this practice has never been excepted by the committee to date. The committee agreed—after consideration of responses provided by Mr Lee, the General Manager of Fair Work Australia, at the estimates hearings—that Mr Lee was able to adequately address questions regarding the administrative aspects of Fair Work Australia as per previous committee practice, and consequently the committee sees no need to change the current practice. The committee agreed that it had the authority to call Justice Giudice but, as per the point above, does not have the obligation to do so. If the committee were to form a different view at a later time, it would be free to do so. (Time expired)

Jacinta Collins (Victoria, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr Deputy President, I too seek leave to make a brief statement.

Leave not granted.

Bob Brown (Tasmania, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I would like to point out that the Australian Greens did not deny leave to Senator Collins.

Alan Ferguson (SA, Deputy-President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The Greens do not have to deny leave. I heard one voice and that is all I need to hear, Senator Brown.

Bob Brown (Tasmania, Australian Greens) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Bob Brown interjecting—

Alan Ferguson (SA, Deputy-President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

You have made your point, Senator Brown, and it is recorded in Hansard.

Question put:

That the motion (Senator Fisher’s) be agreed to.