Guy Barnett (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My question is to the Minister for Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy, Senator Conroy. Can the minister please advise the total cost to date of the National Broadband Network rollout in Tasmania?

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

It is a great mystery to me that I keep getting asked this question. We have completed stage 1 and we are in the process of starting up stage 2—something that has been mentioned in the chamber already. It is supported by the Tasmanian Liberal Party. But what I find comical is that Senator Barnett turned up at estimates and asked me a string of questions that had actually been answered many months before.

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Shadow Assistant Treasurer) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

You obviously do not know the answer!

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

We know the answer. The problem is you do not know the answer when it is already on the public record.

Ian Macdonald (Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for Northern and Remote Australia) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, it distresses me to have to take a point of order on relevance. It is quite clear that the minister has not addressed the one issue raised by Senator Barnett. He only raised one issue: what is the cost. Talking about what Senator Barnett might or might not have done at estimates cannot be anywhere near the requirement of ‘directly relevant’ to the question of the cost of the rollout in Tasmania. Mr President, can I ask you to say to the minister that if he does not know the question he should sit down. He should not be allowed to prattle on about what opposition senators might have done at estimates or elsewhere. If he cannot answer the question, Mr President, you have an obligation to sit him down.

Joe Ludwig (Queensland, Australian Labor Party, Manager of Government Business in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, on the point of order: what the opposition have clearly not been doing is listening to the answer that Senator Conroy has been giving. Senator Conroy has been answering the question. The answer was, if you recall, that it was on the public record. That is clearly within the definition of being relevant to the question. The minister has been answering the question. Those opposite, if they do not read all the public editions, clearly read the Australian, as the first question provided. Nevertheless, the minister is being relevant to the question and there is no point of order.

John Hogg (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The standing orders allow two minutes for the answering of the question. The minister still has one minute 25 seconds remaining of that two minutes in which to answer the question. I cannot instruct the minister how to answer the question, although I am listening to the minister’s answer to the question to ensure that the question is addressed.

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

As I was saying, Senator Barnett came and asked this very question at estimates. If he had bothered to read the Hansard from the previous estimates he would have found the entire contractual price: $37 million. As Mr Quigley has repeatedly said, for stage 1 at $137 million we came in under budget and on time. The reason I cannot answer that specifically is that there is a range of contracts that are currently about to be finalised. So when you say ‘to date’ do you mean at five o’clock today? I am not sure if it was signed yesterday. It may have actually been signed yesterday, Senator Brandis, but I am not managing it on a day-to-day basis. It is actually run by NBN Co. So, if you want to know what stage 1 costs, it has already been put on the public record, and despite Senator Barnett not wanting to bother reading Hansard

Guy Barnett (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, a point of order on relevance: Senator Conroy has referred to a $37 million contract. I asked the question of the total cost to date of the rollout in Tasmania. The senator refused to answer this question at Senate estimates. He is refusing again today. He knows the answer and he is refusing to advise the Senate of the answer. I would ask you to ask him to answer the question or sit him down.

Chris Evans (WA, Australian Labor Party, Leader of the Government in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, on the point of order: I think Senator Barnett just proved the point Senator Conroy made about not listening. He was directly answering the question, indicating what stage 1 had cost and describing the contractual arrangements that would incur further costs. He could not have been more direct if he tried. So I would suggest Senator Barnett listen to the answer, given it is his third go at it.

George Brandis (Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Attorney-General) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, on the point of order: in his answer a few moments before Senate Barnett’s point of order was taken, Senator Conroy said ‘The reason I cannot specifically answer your question’ and went on to explain why he could not answer the question. Now that he has told the Senate that he cannot answer the question, what further he has to say can have no bearing on the question.

John Hogg (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

That is not a point of order. I cannot instruct the minister how to answer the question. Senator Conroy, continue.

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

There is a contractual process that is possibly complete or possibly not complete—and no, I do not get a daily update. That is no great surprise. I do not get a daily update on Australia Post’s operations either—how many postmen went out today. (Time expired)

Guy Barnett (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, I ask a supplementary question. Clearly, the minister has demonstrated he is not on top of his brief. Now that the government has backflipped and agreed that NBN Co. should install and pay for a backup battery with every broadband connection, does it agree with the McKinsey-KPMG report that this will cost an additional $90 million to $150 million each year? Will it reimburse Tasmanians and others who have already paid for the backup batteries?

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

We are in the process of conducting the pilot in Tasmania. The McKinsey report made a number of recommendations, which the government has been considering, but as I have made clear recently we intend to mandate that there be battery backup as insurance if a home, for instance, catches fire as part of the contractual basis from NBN Co. We have made it very clear. We have stated it on a number of occasions—NBN Co. I do not know how many more times I have got to say that to you.

Eric Abetz (Tasmania, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

That was a firm contract. Do you know the price? Was it budgeted?

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Was it budgeted in what, Senator Abetz?

John Hogg (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order! Senator Abetz and Senator Conroy, there should be no exchange across the chamber. Senator Conroy, you should be directing your comments to me.

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The NBN business case, which I will receive very shortly, Mr President, includes that cost. This was a decision that I informed NBN Co. of many, many weeks ago, long before it came up as a public matter of discussion. (Time expired)

Guy Barnett (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, I ask a further supplementary question. Senator Conroy has refused to answer whether he will reimburse Tasmanians or others who have already paid for the backup batteries. Now that the minister has conceded that they do not have a business case prepared yet for the NBN, will the minister agree, upon receipt of that business plan, to release it? Secondly, why won’t the minister submit Australia’s biggest infrastructure project to a cost-benefit analysis?

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

As I have indicated many times, subject to any commercial-in-confidence issues, we will be releasing a raft of information around the business plan. The reason that we are not going to waste Australian taxpayers’ money is that there are hundreds of cost-benefit analyses around Australia about the benefits of broadband to productivity. There are hundreds of them. All you have to do is stop being lazy and actually do it. But the premise of the cost-benefit argument is that you start off with a loss in the business case. As McKinsey made clear, it is financially viable and delivers affordable broadband. I am confident that the business case we are going to be receiving shortly will absolutely reinforce the business plan.

Guy Barnett (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Will you release it?

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Government in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

As I have said, subject to items that may be commercial-in-confidence, the details will be released. (Time expired)